'Urahara... Who are you really?' - The conspiracy theory

[Deranged]

I had initially posted this as a post for that Plot holes thread, and someone suggested I put a thread of it so here it is. Spoilers up to chapter 222 I think.

Talking with my other Bleachers mates (the ones that live down the road) and we came up with a huge conspiracy theory.

The Hougyoku is a huge fake out. Urahara never created the perfect way to merge the powers of Hollows and Shinigami and he is still experimenting (using Ichigo).

We all know that Ichigo is phenomenly different to Vizards and Arrancar being that his shinigaminess and his hollowness were both developed at the same time in the shattered shaft instead of the normal I was one but then I gained the powers of the other deal.

The Hougyoku as used by Aizen turns hollows into arrancar by giving them zanpakuto. This even though of all the hype, is not perfect as can be seen as how the arrancar can be defeated by unamped shinigami (only one to date is ichigo).

Ichigo is also different to the Vizard by the fact that he really didn't beat down his hollow side (my current understanding is that shirosaki and zangetsu are one and the same, kinda) but more like shirosaki gave up to after ichigo regained the will to full out fight (what he has been missing from his fight with grimmjaw). From the previous fight, shirosaki shows a much better fighting standard then ichigo and doesn't seem the type to just give up from one stabbing (like ichigo).

From all this , we gather one definate fact: Ichigo is different. And I think Urahara is behind it. I think the whole soul society arc was Urahara's staged experiment. He started it by not saving rukia for ichigo even though he was probably there at the battle watching Ichigo getting whupped, thus giving Ichigo a reason to fight (to save Rukia) and a reason to get stronger (seeing the large gap of power shown in the fight). Byakuya and Renji are under limits at one fifth of their powers while Urahara is under no such limitation, he would probably take them down easily. Here, he is more like a documentaralist, observing but not interferring.

He is also the start of shirosaki. Ichigo would never have gone hollow to begin with if not for the shattered staff incident. That was the beginning of Urahara's actual Hollow/Shinigami hybrid experiments.

During the whole of SS arc, we have seen the development of shirosaki, saving ichigo from dying by Renji's sword, making him realise how he had to work with his sword to gain zaraki's area of strength, saving his life yet again when he is brutally stabbed by zaraki and finally manifesting itself fully to turn the favour of the fight with Byakuya.

Yourichi acts the way she does by saving ichigo and training him (using an urahara method mind you) because she is really close with urahara and does not want his 'experiment' to fail. The Hougyoku seems to be a fake to lead Aizen off the real hybridnation process which is still being worked out (from the latest chapters we see him at a near full hollow form like obtained by Arrancars but he still obtained his zanpakuto, also after shedding himself, we see that ichigo can use the vizard's method of normal but with a mask).

If this is correct, Urahara is the ultimate manipulator (and if Ichigo ever figures it out, Urahara is gonna get more than a whack in the eye). Everything has been staged and possibly Yourichi and Isshin are behind it as well. Isshin I suspect alot of, because of the fact that he was a shinigami to begin with and must have known about rukia to begin with. (Why was rukia chosen to house the Hougyoku: probably because she was the first shinigami to come into contact with ichigo and they have grown an attachment to each other and thus when she was taken, it forced Ichigo who stated that he doesn't risk his life for nothing. Ichigo seems to be the planned ginea pig to begin with. How did Urahara get there so fast after Ichigo got Rukia's powers with exactly the thing that Rukia needed, a gigai (that had an extra attachment added)).

Again, this is all a pessimistic view that probably came from a lack of sleep, a large influx of sugar and an obsession of bleach but thats my two cents.

So, you've read it. Who the heck is Urahara really? You have seen my opinion and I think the answer is more underneath the underneath as seen above. How about you?

[Sakura Kaijuu]

I agree that Urahara is probably the ultimate manipulator. He knew about the Vaizards, he knew that they'd find Ichigo, he knew about the Arrankar...He's one sneaky bastard.

What I don't think is that the Hougyoku is a complete cop-out. I think it probably has some potential, and that it is a dangerous object.

Since Isshin was revealed to be a shinigami, I've been convinced that he's in on whatever Urahara is scheming from the beginning, but not completely. I think he was probably pretty irritated with Urahara for treating his kid like crap, just because he is a good dad, no matter how goofy he acts.

I'm both worried and curious to find out what's going to happen with Urahara and Isshin. I'm particularly curious about Isshin's role in all this, mostly because of Karin and Ichigo.

[Last of the Arrancar]

We all know that Ichigo is phenomenly different to Vizards and Arrancar being that his shinigaminess and his hollowness were both developed at the same time in the shattered shaft instead of the normal I was one but then I gained the powers of the other deal.


Where do you get that Ichigo is any different form the other Vaizards ? They don't seems to be very surprised by what has happened in the latest chapters, in fact, each and every one of them had to go through the same thing.

The Hougyoku as used by Aizen turns hollows into arrancar by giving them zanpakuto. This even though of all the hype, is not perfect as can be seen as how the arrancar can be defeated by unamped shinigami (only one to date is ichigo).

They were Gillians, and as Hitsugaya stated, Gillians are easy for a captain to defeat. So as hybrids, they became a little harder to defeat.

And what would you call perfect ? Being able to use abilities of both, and this, the Arrancar can ( think of shunpo, a zanpakutou, a release ), and Aizen mentoined perfecting them still , so they will get even stronger.

Ichigo is also different to the Vizard by the fact that he really didn't beat down his hollow side (my current understanding is that shirosaki and zangetsu are one and the same, kinda) but more like shirosaki gave up to after ichigo regained the will to full out fight (what he has been missing from his fight with grimmjaw). From the previous fight, shirosaki shows a much better fighting standard then ichigo and doesn't seem the type to just give up from one stabbing (like ichigo).


This is the law of Shounen, the good guy wins. Even tough it seems wrong, and I also think Shirosaki gave up to quickly. But that doesn't mean Ichigo is any different. I'm sure the hollows of the other Vaizards threatened their respective persona in exactly the same way as Shirosaki did .

From all this , we gather one definate fact: Ichigo is different.

See above, I disagree.


He is also the start of shirosaki. Ichigo would never have gone hollow to begin with if not for the shattered staff incident. That was the beginning of Urahara's actual Hollow/Shinigami hybrid experiments.


Is he ? You could also follow the whole Ichigo=Kaien theory, and in that case, the hollow has been with him the whole time. And since Kubo confirmed that dead shinigami's are reincarnated on earth, and given the similarity of Kaien-Ichigo. Like that hollow said, 'our souls are merged, you can never seperate us ' .

Yourichi acts the way she does by saving ichigo and training him (using an urahara method mind you) because she is really close with urahara and does not want his 'experiment' to fail. The Hougyoku seems to be a fake to lead Aizen off the real hybridnation process which is still being worked out (from the latest chapters we see him at a near full hollow form like obtained by Arrancars but he still obtained his zanpakuto, also after shedding himself, we see that ichigo can use the vizard's method of normal but with a mask).

So what makes you think Hougyoku is bad ? Seems to me any thing that instantly makes a hybrid is a good thing. Keep in mind we have only seen a gillian release, we didn't see Grimmjaw, who is probably adjuca or higher, release, why didn't we see it, becuase it is different from a gillians release, and Kubo doesn't want to reveal that yet.

[Deranged]

What I am saying is the hyouka (sp?) is not a cop out but not the real thing. Maybe a version that did not meet Urahara's desires.

With Arrancar and Vizards, I notice that there is always a permanant dominant personallity (most notibly the side they were first, so for arrancars, their hollow side and vizards, their shinigami sides). Ichigo for most is in a real influx. Even though he 'beat' shirosaki, he does say that he will be back. I don't seem to doubt him since he and Zangetsu seem to be integrated in some way.

I'm not instantly assuming the super hybrid is good, it just makes it better the fact that it has so many options now to fight from.

My theories on Ichigo is the super hybrid may have some holes but it does seem definate that Urahara is causing him to grow in a certain direction.

[Last of the Arrancar]

What I am saying is the hyouka (sp?) is not a cop out but not the real thing. Maybe a version that did not meet Urahara's desires.


If Hougyoku is a flawed version, why would Urahara try so desperatly to hide it ? why should he care what happens to it ?
He could have just send it to Aizen per mail, here ya go, this is the ultimate thing, use it !

With Arrancar and Vizards, I notice that there is always a permanant dominant personallity (most notibly the side they were first, so for arrancars, their hollow side and vizards, their shinigami sides). Ichigo for most is in a real influx. Even though he 'beat' shirosaki, he does say that he will be back. I don't seem to doubt him since he and Zangetsu seem to be integrated in some way.

how do you know Ichigo isn't the same as them, we have never seen their inner hollow, nor have we seen how they got in control, though things would suggest it was exaclty the saem as with Ichigo.

[Deranged]

If Hougyoku is a flawed version, why would Urahara try so desperatly to hide it ? why should he care what happens to it ?
He could have just send it to Aizen per mail, here ya go, this is the ultimate thing, use it !

how do you know Ichigo isn't the same as them, we have never seen their inner hollow, nor have we seen how they got in control, though things would suggest it was exaclty the saem as with Ichigo.

The smarter thing to do is make the flawed version seem like the real deal, thus Aizen will go after it instead of figuring out the true experiment until posibly the point where ichigo kills him. The idea that it was staged this way is why I labled it as possible conspiracy, on urahara's part.

We don't know if Ichigo is the same ore not but there have been slight discrepancies. Add that to the fact that ever shonen main hero always has a little extra and probably always stem from the norm in most cases, I thoroughly think this theory is right. If i am proved wrong later on by the next chapter or something like that, I will gladly change my beliefs.

The fact of the matter is I can't stand to leave holes in my understanding so I try to fill them in the best possible manner and then rebuild them if I find I was wrong (like that Sun revolves around the Earth theory, took me a whole year of believing until my teacher told me I was wrong and explained how it can still provide the same evidence as I had found for my wrong theory.)

[Trias]

Well, for now, it seems like Ichigo is a Vaizard, not a Perfect Hybrid or anything else, but well...

I believe that new chapter is going to explain us a lot... We're going to learn Aizen's real motive, and Shinji probably will explain Ichigo what they've known, and their connections... I believe there will be a connection between them and Urahara...

I'm going to own this thread after the new chapter comes out, mates! :P

[Last of the Arrancar]

Well, to be honest, the whole Urahara thing does not interest me that much... but I at first also thought Ichigo was special, but the more I see of the Vazizards, the more I think he's just the same as them, altough more powerfull .

I believe that new chapter is going to explain us a lot... We're going to learn Aizen's real motive, and Shinji probably will explain Ichigo what they've known, and their connections... I believe there will be a connection between them and Urahara...


That much in 1 chapter ? No way !

[Deranged]

Well, for now, it seems like Ichigo is a Vaizard, not a Perfect Hybrid or anything else, but well...

I believe that new chapter is going to explain us a lot... We're going to learn Aizen's real motive, and Shinji probably will explain Ichigo what they've known, and their connections... I believe there will be a connection between them and Urahara...

I'm going to own this thread after the new chapter comes out, mates! :P

From what we've seen, Ichigo isn't the ultimate hybrid but when hollowed out, you will notice he still has his sword. Something wacky is going on.

Hopefully, the next few chapters will explain some things better so we can make more accurate theories. Also, on our own we can't see everything, so if more people really think, we may get some really good theories.

BTW, Ichigo has some uniqueness things going for him. The fact that he was born with inherant shinigami abilities (that just needed to become activated), the whole hybrid theory I put up and, maybe there are some effects from being the child of a living human and a shinigami in a gigai (? not sure if isshin is in a gigai or something, but the same goes for Urahara yet people can still see tham.) This may have happened before, we may never know but that sure does make him a good candidate to become different from everybody else.

[Trias]

Well, to be honest, the whole Urahara thing does not interest me that much... but I at first also thought Ichigo was special, but the more I see of the Vazizards, the more I think he's just the same as them, altough more powerfull .


That much in 1 chapter ? No way !

You arrancar fan girl, just wait until Urahara's true identify comes to the light!

Yeah, it's hard to believe, isn't it? :laugh

From what we've seen, Ichigo isn't the ultimate hybrid but when hollowed out, you will notice he still has his sword. Something wacky is going on.

Hopefully, the next few chapters will explain some things better so we can make more accurate theories. Also, on our own we can't see everything, so if more people really think, we may get some really good theories.

BTW, Ichigo has some uniqueness things going for him. The fact that he was born with inherant shinigami abilities (that just needed to become activated), the whole hybrid theory I put up and, maybe there are some effects from being the child of a living human and a shinigami in a gigai (? not sure if isshin is in a gigai or something, but the same goes for Urahara yet people can still see tham.) This may have happened before, we may never know but that sure does make him a good candidate to become different from everybody else.

Okay, he had his sword... But, we don't know; it's possible that all shinigami have their sword from the very time they become a shinigami? Please explain what point you are getting to, I don't get it :huh

And being a living human and a shinigami in a gigai's child... Gigais were made of highly concentrated spitrons... That would also explain idiotically high reiatsu Ichigo has got. :nuts Where do you get those ideas from, mate? :nuts

[Deranged]

Well, the whole sword thing is that arrancar lose their swords when they release. Ichigo at that point has reached a hollow form (Mask, hole in chest, the whole chilada) yet still obtains his sword while arrancar do not when they go full hollowy.

The whole gigai thing. I always thought how the hell does a dead guy father three children. The only logical explanation would be through the gigai which may replicate living functions as well.

[Sakura Kaijuu]

What I am saying is the hyouka (sp?) is not a cop out but not the real thing. Maybe a version that did not meet Urahara's desires.

That's what I meant, sorry. :laugh

With Arrancar and Vizards, I notice that there is always a permanant dominant personallity (most notibly the side they were first, so for arrancars, their hollow side and vizards, their shinigami sides). Ichigo for most is in a real influx. Even though he 'beat' shirosaki, he does say that he will be back. I don't seem to doubt him since he and Zangetsu seem to be integrated in some way.

I'm not instantly assuming the super hybrid is good, it just makes it better the fact that it has so many options now to fight from.

My theories on Ichigo is the super hybrid may have some holes but it does seem definate that Urahara is causing him to grow in a certain direction.

I don't think Ichigo is really in flux when it comes to who's in control. Now that he knows that he can beat Shirosaki's ass when the need arises, he kind of just falls into the category of vaizard. It was cool to think of him as the perfect hybrid when it lasted, but now he's like the other vaizards. Plus, there was no denying that Ichigo was the dominant personality to begin with. Shirosaki just made several unpleasant appearances in the time between when Ichigo reclaimed his powers and when he met the vaizards.

[Megaharrison]

I don't think Urahara is a villain but I do think he is hiding many things from us, that will be explained later on.

Of course at the time it seemed IMPOSSIBLE for Aizen to turn out as a villain as well. Kubo Tite loves playing with our minds.

[Deranged]

I don't think Urahara is a villain but I do think he is hiding many things from us, that will be explained later on.

Of course at the time it seemed IMPOSSIBLE for Aizen to turn out as a villain as well. Kubo Tite loves playing with our minds.

I'm not really saying he is a villian, more of he has a real roundabout and unorthodox way of misleading the real villian. He does have villian potential though, but it seems more like he's preparing the best trump card he can against aizen

[MuNaZ]

Urahara is a mistery guy, he Knows much more than he tells...
It's possible what you're saying (some more than others):laugh
If that becomes true it will be the Ultimate Heel Turn:P
But I don't think it will happen Urahara is good guy who hides a lot of thing, knows more than he tells but still a good guy.

[Deranged]

I didnt say he was a villian, I said he has potential. Most likely he is a shady good guy who does things his way

[Hidara]

You could also follow the whole Ichigo=Kaien theory, and in that case, the hollow has been with him the whole time. And since Kubo confirmed that dead shinigami's are reincarnated on earth, and given the similarity of Kaien-Ichigo. Like that hollow said, 'our souls are merged, you can never seperate us ' .
This is the theory I like to go by, rather than blaming Uruhara for Ichigo's hybridization.

I do, however, think that Uruhara is manipulating things. If he had a hand in Ichigo's awakening as a shinigami, I think it's possible that he sent Ichigo to SS more to force Aizen's hand than to rescue Rukia, though that was a beneficial side effect. It seems to me that now is an ideal time for Uruhara to put whatever plan he has into action, since he appears to have built up his allies, and put his pawns in place. Whether his battle is with Aizen, or something else, we have yet to see, and, that's really the suspense that's killing me at the moment.

[Kent]

:nod I don't think he's sooo bad since he said "forgive me" to Ichigo in such a regretful way..And I want him to say that to Rukia too :yell you better Uruhara!! That's the only thing Ichigo asked for :shakefist

*uruhara is unbelievable strong though..We will see later on if he's black or wite* o.O

[Last of the Arrancar]

From what we've seen, Ichigo isn't the ultimate hybrid but when hollowed out, you will notice he still has his sword. Something wacky is going on.

BTW, Ichigo has some uniqueness things going for him. The fact that he was born with inherant shinigami abilities (that just needed to become activated), the whole hybrid theory I put up and, maybe there are some effects from being the child of a living human and a shinigami in a gigai (? not sure if isshin is in a gigai or something, but the same goes for Urahara yet people can still see tham.) This may have happened before, we may never know but that sure does make him a good candidate to become different from everybody else.



Tell me, exactly, what differetiates Ichigo from the other Vaizards, other than that his father is a shinigami, wich would give him exactly what advantage ? Power maybe ?

From what we've seen, Ichigo isn't the ultimate hybrid but when hollowed out, you will notice he still has his sword. Something wacky is going on.
Well, the whole sword thing is that arrancar lose their swords when they release. Ichigo at that point has reached a hollow form (Mask, hole in chest, the whole chilada) yet still obtains his sword while arrancar do not when they go full hollowy.

All Vaizards keep their swords when turning hollow. Nothing would suggest Ichigo is any different by still having his sword when Hollowfying, unless we get the opportunity to see how the other Vaizards subdued their hollows, wich I doubt we will ever see.

You arrancar fan girl, just wait until Urahara's true identify comes to the light!

Yeah, it's hard to believe, isn't it?

And here I was trying to keep it a secret ....

Oh and even IF Hougyoku is flawed ( it seems to be doing a good job ), why give the enemy even a flawed weapon ? He already created powerfull warriors with it, so unless Urahara has like a secret spell, wich turns every anrrancar to dust in a second ( yeah right, then we would have no story left ), why did he let Aizen get it ? Why not keep it yourself and not let Aizen have anything at all.

[Deranged]

Oh and even IF Hougyoku is flawed ( it seems to be doing a good job ), why give the enemy even a flawed weapon ? He already created powerfull warriors with it, so unless Urahara has like a secret spell, wich turns every anrrancar to dust in a second ( yeah right, then we would have no story left ), why did he let Aizen get it ? Why not keep it yourself and not let Aizen have anything at all.

I believe its more to force his hand. He has to sacrifice something of worth to Aizen, the Hyoukyu. Giving up nothing and Aizen will probably think something is off and seek it out more agressively. Giving him something really dodgy and Aizen again will probably think something is off (come on, this is urahara's work we're talking aobut, the man devised a way to achieve Bankai in three days). Creating the elaborate web of lies that puts the Hyoukyu at top priority makes sure no one notices the real deal.

Of course this is all speculation based off of psychological warfare manuevres.

[blazingshadow]

You could also follow the whole Ichigo=Kaien theory, and in that case, the hollow has been with him the whole time.
i had this theory that he got a dormant hollow inside of him at the time rukia transfered her powers to ichigo with the hougyoku inside of her and it awakened in the shattered shaft place but meh.

I at first also thought Ichigo was special, but the more I see of the Vazizards, the more I think he's just the same as them, altough more powerfull .
i agree. he is just a vaizard and nothing more. maybe he's stronger than the rest of the group but not by much. later on urahara or isshin might give another power up to ichigo in some way (i just hope he can use kidou/cero by the time he fights aizen) or make him a much smarter fighter so to beat anybody stronger than him without going vaizard level 2 or something like that

[Trias]

Don't forget that Rukia had Hougyoku inside her after she transfered her power to Ichigo, not before. There is no connection between Ichigo's hollow side & Hougyoku.

[Deranged]

Don't forget that Rukia had Hougyoku inside her after she transfered her power to Ichigo, not before. There is no connection between Ichigo's hollow side & Hougyoku.

Sure, that's what was meant. The hollownification process that Ichigo is going through has no connection to the hougyoku (except maybe the person who created both.)

[that guy over there]

hey dude.
I like this theory. It makes sense and it really got me thinking. some things are off but I see the ideas are being honed in the other posts.

Man, there is some full on debate going on here

[Hokage-of-my-hood]

From all this , we gather one definate fact: Ichigo is different. And I think Urahara is behind it. I think the whole soul society arc was Urahara's staged experiment. He started it by not saving rukia for ichigo even though he was probably there at the battle watching Ichigo getting whupped, thus giving Ichigo a reason to fight (to save Rukia) and a reason to get stronger (seeing the large gap of power shown in the fight). Byakuya and Renji are under limits at one fifth of their powers while Urahara is under no such limitation, he would probably take them down easily. Here, he is more like a documentaralist, observing but not interferring.

Urahara could have defeated them, but obviously that would cause a whole ruckus with Soul Society, and then the people on earth would involved etc. Instead just send Ichigo there and demolish their resolve. Either way, he would have to make Ichigo stronger, if this became a problem with S.S. there would probably be a need to send a few captains to earth, and as strong as Urahara is, he could not have dealt with the whole problem himself. Either way, he would have had to made Ichigo stronger, since he believes Ichigo has a stronger potential than himself and that he had the potential to exceed him. However I do agree that urahara has something planned.

P.S.-whats (sp?) mean?

[Deranged]

Good point there.

(sp?) means I'm unsure of the spelling of the previous word. I put that there because I was supposed to go over my message before I posted it so when i saw that i would check the spelling. I never remember though. At least it means i'm not thinking too much about the spelling that I'm distracted from writing an actual argument this way

[that guy over there]

I think I get what you're saying now and there really is a high probability that Urahara could be behind so much of what's going on. I'm not so sure about this hybrid theory though. At the moment it seems that Ichigo is full on Vizard.

[Quantus347]

Lets keep in mind that Ichigo is VERY different in one important way. His power increases at insane speeds. Nobody really knows what his full potential is, all they know is that he has done in less than a year of high school what it normally takes a soul thousands of years in the afterlife to pull off. Im not saying anything about what that makes him, or where it comes from, cause I dont think we know yet. But that difference is fact.

[Deranged]

What I really think is that it was planned out and Urahara knew all along how much potential Ichigo truly had... this could have all been planned out years before Rukia arrived... Things just dont seem right woth Urahara

[DoNKiNgPiN]

Ok heres my two cents on ichigo being perfect hybrid or being like all other vaizards...first off ichigo has a big big diffrence between the rest of the vaizards 1)he has shinigami dad wich is ubber powerful and at the looks of it was an important shinigami. 2)not only is he shinigami but he went trough shinigami officers, VC and captains and even got bankai in very little time so he is now ubber powerful shinigami. 3) The big diffrence between him and vaizards is this... like somebody mentioned in this thread ichigo didnt really beat down his hollow side but more like ''ok now you got your will to be stronger and keep getting stronger attitude back so we can now both get stronger'' because his hollow side says to zangetsu ''take good care of him his power is gonna be mine someday'' because lets face it ...after being stab just one time the fight could have gone on...how many times have I seen fights with tremendus cuts and blood and keep going on and on in bleach.

so contrary to the other vaizards who seem to have beaten down their hollows to get this power so their hollow sides might not be as cooperative as ichigos so that would make him slightly diffrent from the others seing as their is a considerate power gap

[HugeGuy]

Don't forget that Rukia had Hougyoku inside her after she transfered her power to Ichigo, not before. There is no connection between Ichigo's hollow side & Hougyoku.
This is confusing. I heard others have said that the Hougyoku was already hidden in Rukia's soul way before chapter 1. So, which is true?

[Moridin]

the souls databook has a timeline in it that I think includes the placing of the hougyoku inside Rukia, but I need someone to translate :P

[.hatake.]

If Isshin is involved, then what the heck of a father is he?? Allowing his own son to become a guniea pig for Urahara's experiments?? I don't think so. BUT, I do think Urahara's keeping many things. There would be more of him to be told in the future.

[hjkou]

there's a bit of contradiction in this thread

stating that it IS a shonen manga just supports the idea that ichigo is going to be a perfect hybrid.. hes gotta own someway or another ;p

[Akatsuki_4ever]

Urahara LMAO reminds me a lot of Jiraiya; sneaky, and ever so often all knowing.

This may seem out of topic but do U guys think Tessai is Urahara's VC? This came out of a ridiculous IMO post by someone saying Isshin=Urahara's VC.Or is Tessai just a random Seated Officer in what used to be Urahara's division?