Sonic vs The Flash [Archive]

zizou

04-07-2006, 11:07 PM

If "Light Dash" is actually the speed of light, then I guess Sonic's top speed is the speed of light. However, it requires a path of rings to work and that is pretty situational.

The Flash wins easily here, even if Sonic goes Super Sonic. The Flash's speed is simply divine.
Flash's top speed isn't the speed of light? :huh

az0r

04-08-2006, 12:29 AM

flash wins coz lol

OniTasku

04-08-2006, 03:14 AM

Flash's top speed isn't the speed of light? :huh

Depends which Flash you refer to. In any case, he can go faster than that, apparently.

Flash wins.

lucky

04-08-2006, 03:18 AM

Sonic Wins, Super Sonic can fly... the flash can't sooo it will take awhile for the flash to go around the world ;P but if there are no buildings Flash wins

flash can take the 'long way' around the world and still circle it 50 times before sonic finishes one lap.

Zouri

04-08-2006, 04:08 AM

We just went through this not too long ago. The only differences are that Sonic lost the Chaos Emeralds and Rock Lee gave up and went home.

I'm not going to go and look for my post on the topic but you can if you want to. In either case, Flash wins this hands down. The man can outrun death carrying a little girl. That easily trumps Sonic's speed.

Hype

04-08-2006, 05:18 AM

Flash no contest

omg laser pew pew!

04-08-2006, 06:46 AM

In the time Sonic has taken to catch his breath, Flash would have already run around 30 times, gone to the afterparty, picked up Amy Lee and banged her all night

BladeofTheChad

04-08-2006, 06:48 AM

FLASH WOULD KICK HIS ASS!

Toffeeman

04-08-2006, 01:26 PM

Sonic can only travel faster than the speed of sound, and Super Sonic travels twice that... but it still isn't nearly as fast as what The Flash can travel.

DemonDog

04-10-2006, 08:07 AM

Flash no problem

Blitzkrieg

04-10-2006, 09:57 PM

Flash FTW :)

Envy

04-11-2006, 02:48 AM

Flash can run into a different dimension with the slope of mount everest. It's in one of the JLA books, I think number 13.. Not sure, but he can. Anyways. 50 punches in a second and with sonic's speed, 100 times in a second. Flash wins. Why is this thread here?

Hangatýr

04-11-2006, 08:17 AM

Oh my, yet ANOTHER over-powered hero from DC Comics.

But, in any case, Flash FTW, even though Sonic is much awesomer.

Psysalis

04-11-2006, 08:39 AM

As much as i like sonic,im going to have to go with the flash

Lord Prime

04-14-2006, 09:48 PM

i like both but no one can beat Flash in speed, so Flash wins.

Blitzomaru

04-15-2006, 12:26 PM

Sonic- Super sonic. about 700 mph.

Flash- Speed of light. roughly 186,000 miles per SECOND.

That's like Michael Jordan playing a bunch of kids. No contest.

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 04:47 PM

Sonic can run so fast he can travel through time.

Tun him into super (saiya-jin) sonic and its game over for the flash!

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 04:53 PM

how fast is sonic?

Way faster than The Flash.

Havoc

07-29-2006, 04:56 PM

Sonic can run so fast he can travel through time.

Tun him into super (saiya-jin) sonic and its game over for the flash!

Even if what you said was true about Sonic, which it isn't, Flash can also time travel.

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 05:10 PM

Even if what you said was true about Sonic, which it isn't, Flash can also time travel.

you obviously have not read any Sonic Comics, or even watched any Sonic Anime.

Havoc

07-29-2006, 05:39 PM

you obviously have not read any Sonic Comics, or even watched any Sonic Anime.

Actually I have read the Sonic comics and I haven't seen him time travel, but my reading admitedly is spotty. So I'll assume what you say is true, but even so Flash can also travel through time so I don't really see how Sonics time travel trumps Flash's.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 05:42 PM

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 06:09 PM

Unless Sonic utilizes Chaos Control, he loses.

Flash can take Sonic's speed and add it on to his own, if he wanted to.

Super Sonic on the other hand. . . not sure how he is in terms of speed, when compared to Flash. However, SS is one freaking powerful mofo.

Sonic in his normal mode can go lightspeed! Sonic is not going to sit their and let Flash take his speed.

If Sonic goes Super (Saiya-jin) Sonic, it is LIGHTS OUT for the Flash.:)

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 06:41 PM

Actually I have read the Sonic comics and I haven't seen him time travel, but my reading admitedly is spotty. So I'll assume what you say is true, but even so Flash can also travel through time so I don't really see how Sonics time travel trumps Flash's.

Well Sonic has Super Sonic.:P

Zouri

07-29-2006, 06:46 PM

GoldenJoe

07-29-2006, 06:47 PM

as much as i hate to say it flash wins. but most sonic games are still awesome!

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 06:52 PM

Oh god, not this again. Please not this again. I'm a huge Sonic fan and I've written tons of material on the subject already and I don't want to pull it out. Please just go search for it. Super Sonic can't beat the Flash. Though I don't know why we are using Super Sonic when the title clearly states: "Sonic vs The Flash."

A huge fan?:huh You sure don't sound like it.

Sonic CAN go light speed in his Normal mode.

Sonic CAN use chaos control (like shadow) which can be used to TELEPORT and for FREEZING TIME.

Sonic can also cut through solid steel with his body spikes in normal form

Super Sonic is INDESTRUCTABLE and can fly.

Add powers ups like his Fire sheild,magnetic bubble etc and Flash loses.:)

Endless Mike

07-29-2006, 06:57 PM

Just to point out, Flash can vibrate through solid objects, so he doesn't have to avoid any obstacles, he can just go right through them.

Oh, and would phenomenol care to actually provide proof to back up his claims?

Ion

07-29-2006, 07:03 PM

Sonic CAN go light speed in his Normal mode.:blink When was this?
Sonic CAN use chaos control (like shadow) which can be used to TELEPORT and for FREEZING TIME.Can you provide scans?
Sonic can also cut through solid steel with his body spikes in normal formHow can this help him when his opponent is running at or above light speed?
Super Sonic is INDESTRUCTABLE and can fly.
This isn't about Super Sonic though.....>_>
Add powers ups like his Fire sheild,magnetic bubble etc and Flash loses.:)Assuming that random boxes are just lying about for him, in the time it took for him to jump on one of them and let it activate, Flash would have already won the race.

Zouri

07-29-2006, 07:19 PM

A huge fan?:huh You sure don't sound like it.

Sonic CAN go light speed in his Normal mode.

You seem to forget that he needs rings to use "Light Speed Dash," which doesn't even look light speed. What's more, there has to be a path of rings. Flash just disrupts the path using his speed that is GREATER THAN TIME AND SPACE, and Sonic is stuck.

Sonic CAN use chaos control (like shadow) which can be used to TELEPORT and for FREEZING TIME.

Sonic needs a chaos emerald for that. No chaos emerald was given.

Fail.

Sonic can also cut through solid steel with his body spikes in normal form

Yea, but what does this have to do with a race?

Super Sonic is INDESTRUCTABLE and can fly.

Once again, what the hell does indestructability have to do with a race? And his ability to fly isn't that great. His flight speed is pretty slow and Super Sonic is only about light speed at best. The Flash is way faster.

Add powers ups like his Fire sheild,magnetic bubble etc and Flash loses.:)

Fire shield is the only useful one here. It boosts his speed for a short time. Not that it's going to be fast enough.

Electric shield will actually hurt him as it makes it more difficult to Light Speed Dash because all the rings are flying at him.

Bubble just allows him to breath underwater and bounce? What's that gonna do?

Sonic is mighty, but not up against The Flash.

Edit: Just so you know, a real fan should be able to see the limits of his character.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 07:23 PM

Sonic CAN go light speed in his Normal mode.

So. . . when was that in Archie? Or in the games?

Sonic CAN use chaos control (like shadow) which can be used to TELEPORT and for FREEZING TIME.

Needs a Chaos Emerald, if I remember correctly. Shadow's the hedgehog who can use Chaos Control and other chaos effects without an Emerald.

Sonic can also cut through solid steel with his body spikes in normal form

So?

Super Sonic is INDESTRUCTABLE and can fly.

Yes, he's taken on powerful beings.

Add powers ups like his Fire sheild,magnetic bubble etc and Flash loses.

Are we discussing game Sonic or Archie comics Sonic or Fleetway Sonic?

You do know, this is a race around the world.

Jin22

07-29-2006, 07:24 PM

I bet Goku couldn't beat Sonic--in a race I mean... >_>

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 07:28 PM

Actually, you'd be surprise once you get into a Super Sonic vs. SSJ3 Goku argument.

Zouri

07-29-2006, 07:30 PM

Sonic CAN go light speed in his Normal mode.

So. . . when was that in Archie? Or in the games?

Well, the "Light Speed Dash" is supposedly light speed. But you need a path of rings and doesn't look light speed. One could make an arguement that Chaos Control is light speed, but since that's slowing/stopping time it's depends on who's using it.

Both are from the games so they are "cannon" abilities, if you care about those things.

Sonic CAN use chaos control (like shadow) which can be used to TELEPORT and for FREEZING TIME.

Needs a Chaos Emerald, if I remember correctly. Shadow's the hedgehog who can use Chaos Control and other chaos effects without an Emerald.

Correct, sorta. In some games (Sonic Battle), he can use abilities with no problem. But in bigger games such as Shadow the Hedgehog, he still needs an emerald. So I'm just going to say that he needs an emerald.

Add powers ups like his Fire sheild,magnetic bubble etc and Flash loses.

Are we discussing game Sonic or Archie comics Sonic or Fleetway Sonic?

Probably games if we're using the shields. I just use games because the games came first and are the source material for most Sonic comics and TV shows.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 07:32 PM

Ion

07-29-2006, 07:44 PM

On a different note, game Super Sonic is one powerful mofo. . . one damn powerful mofo. . .No accomplishment in any game that I've ever played surpassed when I finally collected all of the Emeralds and got Super Sonic. It was soooooo much fun to play as him.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 07:45 PM

No accomplishment in any game that I've ever played surpassed when I finally collected all of the Emeralds and got Super Sonic. It was soooooo much fun to play as him.

Try Sonic 3 & Knuckles.

Collecting the 7 Chaos Emeralds?

How about succeeding in collecting the 7 Super Emeralds?

Hyper Sonic was a dream come true. . .

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 07:48 PM

Just to point out, Flash can vibrate through solid objects, so he doesn't have to avoid any obstacles, he can just go right through them.

Actually, Archie comics Sonic can vibrate his molecules too.

If I remember the issue correctly, it was the one where Sonic finally debuts with his green eyes (SA adaption or incoporation). The issue was chronically chaotic; whatever the present moment was, the issue progressed in 30 min before, 2 days after, 9 days before, etc., or something like that.

In one of them, to get somewhere, Sonic held onto Princess Sally's hand, vibrated his molecules (states this outwardly, by Sonic), and travelled (to Knothole, presumably).

So, Sonic (from Archie comics only) can vibrate his molecules.

Zouri

07-29-2006, 07:53 PM

Well, the "Light Speed Dash" is supposedly light speed. But you need a path of rings and doesn't look light speed.

In SA2?

The "Light Dash" was only usuable on a trail of rings.

And the "Light Speed Attack" was only useful against a group of enemies, homing in on them.

Yea, that's what I was talking about. The "Light Dash." I'm pretty sure the term, Light Speed Dash, is more commonly used, but whatever. And yea, it does need a trail of rings.

One could make an arguement that Chaos Control is light speed, but since that's slowing/stopping time it's depends on who's using it.

Chaos Control manipulates both time and space, if I remember the games correctly.

In a race, I'd give it to Flash 7 to 8 times out of 10, against game Sonic.

Super Sonic, not so sure.

Yes, Chaos control manipulates both time and space. But it's main problem is that it does take time to stop using the ability. When characters use Chaos control, it takes time for them to re-appear after they have finished moving. This is seen when Sonic uses Chaos control to return to Space Colony ARK, during the battle between Sonic and Shadow, and when Super Sonic and Super Shadow move ARK.

I'd still give it up to Flash in a race against Super Sonic though. I say he's only about light speed, and that Chaos Control wouldn't really do him much good because of its weakness.

On a different note, game Super Sonic is one powerful mofo. . . one damn powerful mofo. . .

Archie and Fleetway comics version, arguably more so.

Never really did look into comic Super Sonics, since there are about 20 of em'. Are they really that much greater than game Super Sonic?

Edit:
Hyper Sonic was a dream come true. . .

Too bad he never showed up again...

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 08:07 PM

Never really did look into comic Super Sonics, since there are about 20 of em'. Are they really that much greater than game Super Sonic?

Super Sonic vs. Hyper Knuckles. A collision between the two of them destroyed the dimension they were in, if I remember correctly.

Fleetway Super Sonic, I have less information on. However, people say that he's able to destroy reality, and his personality is very much like Kid Buu's, but with more intelligence. Apparently, he saved a planet from destruction so that he himself can cause havoc upon it.

However, looking for Sonic the Comic is damn hard, so I can't verify that.

And there is a Archie counterpart to Hyper Sonic. Somewhat.

With a single Super Emerald, Sonic becomes Ultra Sonic. He also gains the ability to take on the characteristics of the environment that he was in, such as Polar Sonic, Tundra Sonic, and so.

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 08:14 PM

So. . . when was that in Archie? Or in the games?

Needs a Chaos Emerald, if I remember correctly. Shadow's the hedgehog who can use Chaos Control and other chaos effects without an Emerald.

So?

Yes, he's taken on powerful beings.

Are we discussing game Sonic or Archie comics Sonic or Fleetway Sonic?

You do know, this is a race around the world.

I 'm not going by just the anime I'm going by everything, comics, games, cartoons and TWO different animes.

Regardless of what people want to say Sonic can go lightspeed, I mean the flash doesn't go light speed in the Superman TAS or Justice league cartoon but does that mean that he can't? How often does flash actually go to light speed in the JLA comics?? I've read the first 76 issues and so far he hasn't. Does that mean that he can't?

You do know that if either one went to light speed the show would be pretty boring. Its common sense.

Yes, Chaos control manipulates both time and space. But it's main problem is that it does take time to stop using the ability.

What? Choas Control takes no time at all, all you have to say is the words then bang time stops.:huh

Zouri

07-29-2006, 08:16 PM

What? Choas Control takes no time at all, all you have to say is the words then bang time stops.:huh

I already explained that.

Yes, Chaos control manipulates both time and space. But it's main problem is that it does take time to stop using the ability. When characters use Chaos control, it takes time for them to re-appear after they have finished moving. This is seen when Sonic uses Chaos control to return to Space Colony ARK, during the battle between Sonic and Shadow, and when Super Sonic and Super Shadow move ARK.

Read the whole post please. Kthxbie.

Jin22

07-29-2006, 08:25 PM

I mean the flash doesn't go light speed in the Superman TAS or Justice league cartoon but does that mean that he can't? How often does flash actually go to light speed in the JLA comics?? I've read the first 76 issues and so far he hasn't. Does that mean that he can't?This is a good point. We all know Flash can go light speed however because it's has definitely been said both in the JLA(I beleive) and in his own comic book that he can go the speed of light. Until Sonic time travels then Flash wins this race.

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 08:29 PM

This is a good point. We all know Flash can go light speed however because it's has definitely been said both in the JLA(I beleive) and in his own comic book that he can go the speed of light. Until Sonic time travels then Flash wins this race.

Sonic can run so fast that he goes backward and forward through time. Flash needs help to go back in time.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 08:30 PM

I 'm not going by just the anime I'm going by everything, comics, games, cartoons and TWO different animes.

Uh. . . you do know that there are subtle and notable differences between the games, comics, cartoons, and the animes?

Regardless of what people want to say Sonic can go lightspeed,

In game? Debatable. . .

Archie comics? Twice the speed of sound, if I'm not mistaken. As Super Sonic, he states he can go lightspeed. Ultra Sonic, he circled the globe a few dozen times.

I mean the flash doesn't go light speed in the Superman TAS or Justice league cartoon but does that mean that he can't?

Perhaps.

How often does flash actually go to light speed in the JLA comics?? I've read the first 76 issues and so far he hasn't. Does that mean that he can't?

He can go lightspeed in the comics.

If not in the JLA comics, then certainly in the Flash comics.

You do know that if either one went to light speed the show would be pretty boring. Its common sense.

What, Sonic or Flash?

What? Choas Control takes no time at all, all you have to say is the words then bang time stops.

AND have a Chaos Emerald. The exception is Shadow.

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 08:38 PM

In game? Debatable. . .

Sonic can go lightspeed in the games, why do oyu think he has "Lightspeed Dash, and other Lightspeed variables? You know perfectly well that limits must be placed when a game is made otherwise it would be too easy. If they made a flash video game do you think he would be racing around at lightspeed for the entire game????? I think not. He'd probably have to collect some cheesy lightning bolt power up

He can go lightspeed in the comics.

If not in the JLA comics, then certainly in the Flash comics.

What, Sonic or Flash?

Both.

AND have a Chaos Emerald. The exception is Shadow.

Sonic uses this ability as well, He used Chaos Control before.

If Sonic turns Super Sonic Good night Flash.

Jin22

07-29-2006, 08:40 PM

Sonic can run so fast that he goes backward and forward through time. Flash needs help to go back in time.Though I've beaten nearly all Sonic games created (he hasn't traveled through time in any of those games and it's never been stated how fast he was actually going.), I'll admit that I'm not too familier with any of his comics. If you could support your claim with a scan or anything to prove Sonic traveling through time or going the speed of light, then we got a race on our hands.

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 08:56 PM

Though I've beaten nearly all Sonic games created (he hasn't traveled through time in any of those games and it's never been stated how fast he was actually going.), I'll admit that I'm not too familier with any of his comics. If you could support your claim with a scan or anything to prove Sonic traveling through time or going the speed of light, then we got a race on our hands.

You ever played Sonic CD! He did it their.:)

Jin22

07-29-2006, 09:03 PM

You ever played Sonic CD! He did it their.:)LOL

That's funny, Sonic CD is the only Sonic game I haven't played. All I'm waiting for now is proof. Don't say something among the likes, "go play the game". Sega CD's are a little hard to come by now...

Edit: If only you knew how bad I want to say... : NO HE DIDN'T!!!! smile-big

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 09:09 PM

You ever played Sonic CD! He did it their.

Time Stones.

Plus, you need to cross a sign in order to be allowed to time travel.

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 09:17 PM

That was via a time post, but you still had to run really fast to get into the past/future.

The stone only altered the past so Robotnik did not take over it.

Flash needs help to run back in time. He does not do this with his own power.

Gunners

07-29-2006, 09:17 PM

I know he can travel through dimensions and possibly time i would have to re read to check the time thing. Super sonic i know he moves faster than gravity if that is anything.

Sonic though i thought he moved at the speed of sound?

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 09:22 PM

That was via a time post, but you still had to run really fast to get into the past/future.

Still need to cross the time post in the game.

The stone only altered the past so Robotnik did not take over it.

He would, if you didn't destroy the Metal Sonic thing and destroy that other, gate thingyin the game.

Visit the future, and you see what happened.

Flash needs help to run back in time.

Where was that stated?

Jin22

07-29-2006, 09:27 PM

I know he can travel through dimensionsHowever impressive it is, traveling through dimensional space isn't a speed feat.

Example: Nightcrawler of the X-men

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 09:29 PM

Well guess what, the Flash needs help to time travel, so it is not impressive because it is not his own speed.

Lets be real here, in a fight Sonic will KO the Flash, and Sonic will win in a race.

Jin22

07-29-2006, 09:36 PM

You ever played Sonic CD! He did it their.

Time Stones.

Plus, you need to cross a sign in order to be allowed to time travel.I think this post meant, Sonic needs help to travel time as well.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 09:38 PM

Lets be real here, in a fight Sonic will KO the Flash, and Sonic will win in a race.

And what's to prevent Sonic from having his speed benig stolen and augmented on Flash's own?

Gunners

07-29-2006, 09:40 PM

Still need to cross the time post in the game.

Well you could say he was fast enough to do it, as the post was charged on his speed, similar to the running time treadmill i think.

Where was that stated?

Well in all truth i never actually saw Flash travel back freely, like i think he needs a specific lock, though you know more than i do so i can't really comment much.

However impressive it is, traveling through dimensional space isn't a speed feat.

Is this time as the machine is charged by his speed.

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 09:47 PM

Lets be real here, in a fight Sonic will KO the Flash, and Sonic will win in a race.

And what's to prevent Sonic from having his speed benig stolen and augmented on Flash's own?

Same way Zoom stopped Flash, punching the Flash.:)

If Sonic transforms into Super Sonic and uses chaos control Flash is dead.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 09:47 PM

Well you could say he was fast enough to do it, as the post was charged on his speed, similar to the running time treadmill i think.

It didn't take much length to time travel. Just get a good run after hitting the post without abruptly stopping, and there you go, and a nice animation follows after.

Well in all truth i never actually saw Flash travel back freely, like i think he needs a specific lock, though you know more than i do so i can't really comment much.

The Cosmic Treadmill was built as to provide Flash accuracy in where he travels through time. That I know.

Scorpio3.14

07-29-2006, 09:50 PM

Flash (Wally West) can time travel under his own power. He is the only one to not need the Cosmic Tredmill to time travel. In fact in one issue the Cosmic Tredmill was destroyed and Jay was saying that while Wally can time travel freely on his own, the rest of the speedster's needed the Tredmill to do so, but they couldnt because it was destoryed. Wally then basically says, No problem and runs back in time, grabs the Tredmill before it was destroyed and is back a second later with the Tredmill.

EDIT: Found the issue. Flash v2 # 145

http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/5816/flash145p14om2.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/453/flash145p15lb7.jpg

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 09:52 PM

Same way Zoom stopped Flash, punching the Flash.

Please.

The basis of Zoom's powers is manipulating his reference frame of time. It simulates the effect of super speed, but is not super speed.

Sonic still has his speed taken.

If Sonic transforms into Super Sonic and uses chaos control Flash is dead.

Super Sonic is overkill, IMO.

He needs a Chaos Emerald to use Chaos Control. Shadow's the hedgehog who can use Chaos Control without an Emerald.

And plus, this is a RACE. Or did you not read the first post?

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 10:01 PM

Please.

The basis of Zoom's powers is manipulating his reference frame of time. It simulates the effect of super speed, but is not super speed.

Sonic still has his speed taken.

I think not. Flash still could not take it, Zoom punched him and stopped the Flash's momentum. Sonic will easily stop the Flash as well. You act as if Sonic is going to sit their and let his speed be taken.:)

Super Sonic is overkill, IMO.

Indeed he is. That is why Flash is KO'd.:)

And plus, this is a RACE. Or did you not read the first post?

In a race Super Sonic >>>>>> Flash!

Yeah it better be a race, to save your precious Flash.:P

Endless Mike

07-29-2006, 10:08 PM

It's specifically stated that Flash can't steal Zoom's speed because it is temporal - based.

Jin22

07-29-2006, 10:11 PM

I was looking for a scan but instead got this directlty from the Wikipedia: --(Wally) West mainlines the power from the (speed)force itself and cannot be cut off from the source, unlike the others(speedsters). Wally has, on several occasions, sped faster than light and been pulled into and exited the Speed Force by his own volition. He can create his costume out of pure speed energy, and can either impart his high velocities to other people and objects already in motion or steal the velocity they possess.--

Can Sonic travel the speed of light or not? If not, then it's an utter and obvious loss.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 10:14 PM

I think not. Flash still could not take it, Zoom punched him and stopped the Flash's momentum.

Do you even know why Zoom's speed can't be stolen? Jay Garrick explained it, in either #198 or #199.

And how fast is Super Sonic? Archie-comics, he states he can attain lightspeed.

Can Sonic travel the speed of light or not? If not, then it's an utter and obvious loss.

In the Archie comics somewhere, he says he can go twice the speed of sound.

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 10:22 PM

Can Sonic travel the speed of light or not? If not, then it's an utter and obvious loss.

Yes Sonic can go the speed of light in the games and cartoons, even in the anime.

Endless Mike

07-29-2006, 10:26 PM

I remember a show I watched along time ago, when someone told Sonic to go to someplace 600 miles away and then come back, so he left, and then some people had an entire conversation before he was back and he didn't come back for several minutes.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 10:29 PM

Yes Sonic can go the speed of light in the games

Which games?

S1, S2, S3, S&K, S3&K, SA1, SA2, SH, SR?

and cartoons,

Adv. of Sonic?
SatAM?
Underground?

even in the anime.

The OVA and X?

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 10:38 PM

Which games?

S1, S2, S3, S&K, S3&K, SA1, SA2, SH, SR?

In all of them. Since Sonic Adventure 1 & 2. he was moving that fast.

Some of sonics moves are actually called:

Light Dash:

Light Speed attack

Do you think the name is just cosmetic? :huh

Adv. of Sonic?
SatAM?
Underground?

The OVA and X?

Yep. Most of those, especially in the Animes OVA.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 10:48 PM

In all of them. Since Sonic Adventure 1 & 2. he was moving that fast.

Some of sonics moves are actually called:

Light Dash:

Light Speed attack

Do you think the name is just cosmetic?

From my SA2 Prima's Official Strategy Guide, nothing about the Light Dash and the Light Speed Attack says anything about lightspeed.

For the Light Dash, a trail of rings is needed. The Light Speed Attack, a horde of enemies.

Yep. Most of those, especially in the Animes OVA.

Does it even explicitly state Sonic going at lightspeed?

Of all I watched, I remember the (dubbed) OVA the most. Nowhere does it says he goes lightspeed.

Jin22

07-29-2006, 10:56 PM

Waiting on that 'Sonic traveling the speed of light' proof.

All we got so far is a quote from a comic saying Sonic can go twice the speed of sound, which still isn't even close to the speed of light. There are jets in existence that can travel twice the speed of sound, and I wish there was an aircraft that could travel the speed of light.

Gunners

07-29-2006, 11:01 PM

Sonic doesn't travell at light speed, i think Super sonic does, but not normal Sonic.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 11:13 PM

Archie Super Sonic does travel light speed, if I remember correctly.

Man, I shouldn't have gave away my Archie comics. . .

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 11:19 PM

From my SA2 Prima's Official Strategy Guide, nothing about the Light Dash and the Light Speed Attack says anything about lightspeed.

For the Light Dash, a trail of rings is needed. The Light Speed Attack, a horde of enemies.

The names says it all CBG! Light Speed Attack/Dash is definetly what it is lightspeed.

Does it even explicitly state Sonic going at lightspeed?

Of all I watched, I remember the (dubbed) OVA the most. Nowhere does it says he goes lightspeed.

Yes, have you watched Sonic the Anime series. Also in the Archie Comics Sonic can Go lightspeed.

It is overkill if Sonic transforms, Flash looses in battle and in a race.

Havoc

07-29-2006, 11:22 PM

Yes, have you watched Sonic the Anime series. Also in the Archie Comics Sonic can Go lightspeed.

It is overkill if Sonic transforms, Flash looses in battle and in a race.

How exactly would Flash lose in a race? Flash steals his speed and it's gameover.

Endless Mike

07-29-2006, 11:23 PM

Just because a move has 'lightspeed' in it's name doesn't mean it's literal.

Or else that means Flash's Infinite Mass Punch literally has infinite mass, and thus he could destroy the universe.

Comic Book Guy

07-29-2006, 11:29 PM

The names says it all CBG! Light Speed Attack/Dash is definetly what it is lightspeed.

Even IF it is at lightspeed, it's still restricted to a path of rings and a horde of enemies respectively.

Yes, have you watched Sonic the Anime series. Also in the Archie Comics Sonic can Go lightspeed.

Archie Super Sonic, actually.

It is overkill if Sonic transforms, Flash looses in battle and in a race.

Flash loses in battle against Super Sonic perhaps, but not in a race.

What's to still stop Flash from stealing speed?

Yes, have you watched Sonic the Anime series.

Sonic Underground, SatAM, and Sonic the Hedgehog: the Movie (dubbed). Now point out to me where did it ever say he went at lightspeed.

In the anime (Sonic X), no, I have not yet seen it.

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 11:52 PM

The names says it all CBG! Light Speed Attack/Dash is definetly what it is lightspeed.

Even IF it is at lightspeed, it's still restricted to a path of rings and a horde of enemies respectively.

Archie Super Sonic, actually.

Flash loses in battle against Super Sonic perhaps, but not in a race.

What's to still stop Flash from stealing speed?

Sonic Underground, SatAM, and Sonic the Hedgehog: the Movie (dubbed). Now point out to me where did it ever say he went at lightspeed.

In the anime (Sonic X), no, I have not yet seen it.

You act as if Sonic is going to sit their and let his speed be stolen:notrust Flash will get punched if he tries that. Like I said Sonic is overall better than the Flash.

Well lets see flash survive in the vacccum of space then

Lets see him fly

Lets seem him sky dive and out of a plane and land without a parachute unharmed

Btw I didn't see him doing many knock outs when the JLA fought the white martians in the comics. In fact I seem to recall them getting their rears kicked quite a bit.

Endless Mike

07-29-2006, 11:53 PM

Look in the Flash vs. Buu thread, I posted scans of Flash running through space and doing a whole bunch of stuff.

Phenomenol

07-29-2006, 11:54 PM

Nothing compared to Sonic. I do not think you understand all Sonic has to do is Transform into Super Sonic and Flash dies.

Also your Flash vs. Kid Buu thread is a bunch of crap.

Havoc

07-29-2006, 11:57 PM

Nothing compared to Sonic. I do not think you understand all Sonic has to do is Transform into Super Sonic and Flash dies.

You do realize this isn't a fight right?

Comic Book Guy

07-30-2006, 12:00 AM

You act as if Sonic is going to sit their and let his speed be stolen Flash will get punched if he tries that.

How can he punch Flash if he can't move?

Like I said Sonic is overall better than the Flash.

Due to the benefits of Super Sonic, I would have to agree.

Well lets see flash survive in the vacccum of space then

Super Sonic can survive space. Regular Sonic can't.

Archie Sonic can't, for sure. He needs a space suit.

Lets see him fly

So?

Lets seem him sky dive and out of a plane and land without a parachute unharmed

He could simply move his arms at super-speed to create a cushion of wind when he lands. However, since he hasn't, he most likely can't.

Why would he skydive in the first place?

Btw I didn't see him doing many knock outs when the JLA fought the white martians in the comics. In fact I seem to recall them getting their rears kicked quite a bit.

Issues?

Usually, Super Sonic is the one that goes at lightspeed, not regular Sonic.

Have you even played Sonic Adventure 2, and see the blurb when you get the Ancient Light and the Light Shoes?

Plus, if you believe SA game Sonic run at lightspeed due to those features, so can Shadow.

Comic Book Guy

07-30-2006, 12:04 AM

Nothing compared to Sonic. I do not think you understand all Sonic has to do is Transform into Super Sonic and Flash dies.

It's not a fight.

It's a race.

Against regular Sonic, Flash wins.

Against Super Sonic, I can see Flash getting a problem.

Most, if not all, Super Sonic incarnations can attain lightspeed. FTL, not sure, although some Sonic readers say that Archie Super Sonic can, if not Ultra Sonic (powered by a Super Emerald)

Although Flash can steal speed, I'm not surewhether it woul work against Super Sonic, due to the Chaos energy that sustains him, provided from the Chaos Emeralds.

Phenomenol

07-30-2006, 12:06 AM

How can he punch Flash if he can't move?

Flash's speed steal is not instant, do not feed me that.

Due to the benefits of Super Sonic, I would have to agree.

Indeed.

Super Sonic can survive space. Regular Sonic can't.

Archie Sonic can't, for sure. He needs a space suit.

So?

That is why the Flash is always getting physically punished, because he is weak.

He could simply move his arms at super-speed to create a cushion of wind when he lands. However, since he hasn't, he most likely can't.

Exactly, Broken legs anyone:amazed

Why would he skydive in the first place?

Let's just say he was thrown out of a plane.

Usually, Super Sonic is the one that goes at lightspeed, not regular Sonic.

Have you even played Sonic Adventure 2, and see the blurb when you get the Ancient Light and the Light Shoes?

Yes.

Plus, if you believe SA game Sonic run at lightspeed due to those features, so can Shadow.

Shadow was said to rival Sonic in speed, so I would not be surprised.

Gunners

07-30-2006, 12:13 AM

Look in the Flash vs. Buu thread, I posted scans of Flash running through space and doing a whole bunch of stuff.

You know i asked for the issue no. where that happened so i could check the circumstances, you still haven't told me.

Right in fairness isn't this a race, so Flash stealing his speed is somewhat cheating as it is somewhat attacking the racer, when people say things think, i remember some guy saying ''You know they are racing and this isn't a fight right'' so since it is a race Flash should not actually be able to steal his speed otherwise it is cheating.

Endless Mike

07-30-2006, 12:20 AM

That's because I don't know the issue number, I found it in a respect thread that didn't give the issue numbers.

Gunners

07-30-2006, 12:27 AM

That's because I don't know the issue number, I found it in a respect thread that didn't give the issue numbers.

Oh so you posted the picture not knowing anything on the circumstance? Well i don't really trust it so much, i don't know what time frame it was under, or whether they provided anything for him.

Endless Mike

07-30-2006, 12:31 AM

The circumstances were pretty clear from the scans, you're just being stubborn.

Unless you have evidence of strange circumstances, you have to accept the feats.

Comic Book Guy

07-30-2006, 01:18 AM

You know i asked for the issue no. where that happened so i could check the circumstances, you still haven't told me.

The Flash #135 to #138; The Human Race, by Grant Morrison.

Comic Book Guy

07-30-2006, 01:31 AM

Havoc

07-30-2006, 01:37 AM

He didn't actually ran in space, per-se.

I'm re-reading it right now (I have EVERY Wally West comic on my comp).

In Flash #136, he's "running on a racetrack that curves in and out of the landscape of spacetime itself".

Hmmm upload them and I'll send you a dollar and a snickers. We should have just used KC Flash it would have been easier.

Endless Mike

07-30-2006, 01:39 AM

Comic Book Guy

07-30-2006, 01:40 AM

Hmmm upload them and I'll send you a dollar and a snickers. We should have just used KC Flash it would have been easier.

Every comic?

I'd have to upload the entire series, as well as the Secret Files, Specials, Annuals, and 80 page Giants.

Over 2 gigs on my hardrive is already taken up.

Comic Book Guy

07-30-2006, 01:42 AM

Still means he can survive in space.

Hmm. . . possible.

The radio-friend said he nearly died in racing in an environment which was deadly; his opponent died during that race.

So, it's possible that Wally could survive space, seeing as the gamblers don't provide them any benefit other than a racetrack.

SoulTaker540

07-30-2006, 10:50 AM

In a race or fight vs base Sonic I think it goes to the Flash,the guy outran death,TWICE!!In a fight,I don't see how you can't give it to Super Sonic,he is broken beyond belief,I'd actually call him one of the strongest characters ever.He is up there with Dark Schiedner(sp?)and Marvel Cosmics.The guy takes on galaxy,no dimension destroying opponents,him and Hyper Knuckles are so strong they made a tear in the space-time continuum.As far as a race if SS can't use Chaos Control then Flash can't steal speed.

Gunners

07-30-2006, 11:44 AM

The Flash #135 to #138; The Human Race, by Grant Morrison.

Thanks a lot, and i will read the chapter.

Still means he can survive in space.

But he can't move.

Unless you have evidence of strange circumstances, you have to accept the feats.

Anyway i wasn't being stubborn and i was right to hold out he didn't actually run in space he had a track to move on.

Endless Mike

07-30-2006, 12:13 PM

Check the Flash vs. Buu thread, I posted scans of him running in space from OWAW.

SoulTaker540

07-30-2006, 12:15 PM

Didn't CBG say it was on a track though?

Endless Mike

07-30-2006, 12:17 PM

Not in OWAW, that was a totally different comic.

SoulTaker540

07-30-2006, 12:33 PM

He would still take base Sonic to town in a race,fight,million dollar cook off.Super Sonic would take a fight and probably a race.

Ion

07-30-2006, 12:34 PM

Gunners

07-30-2006, 01:33 PM

Not in OWAW, that was a totally different comic.

Issue no. please, one of them was already disproven, i would like to see the circumstance of this one aswell.

Endless Mike

07-30-2006, 01:38 PM

The JLA was fighting the Imperiex Probes that were attacking earth.

And how was the first one 'disproven'?

Just because the gamblers set a path for him to follow doesn't mean he couldn't run in space or survive there on his own.

Gunners

07-30-2006, 02:08 PM

And how was the first one 'disproven'?

You used it to claim he could run in space, when he didn't actually run in space, so it doesn't disprove him not being able to fly.

The JLA was fighting the Imperiex Probes that were attacking earth.

Issues, what no. ?

Endless Mike

07-30-2006, 02:16 PM

He did run in space, it was never explicitly stated that he couldn't, so it's not disproven.

As for the issue numbers, I have a TPB which has the panels in it, but it doesn't state which issue precisely, only that the TPB is a compilation of the following issues:

Superman 171
Adventures of Superman 593
Superman: The Man of Steel 115
Action Comics 780
Supergirl 59
Superman 172
JLA: Our Worlds at War 1
Adventures of Superman 594
Superman: The Man of Steel 116
Action Comics 781

So it's in one of those.

Jin22

07-30-2006, 03:02 PM

When did this race make it all the way to space???

Archie Super Sonic does travel light speed, if I remember correctly.Not being too familier with any of Sonic's comics, this is the information I was requesting from the beginning. Anyway, it seems that Sonic would have to upgrade himself into Super mode to inable light speed. Even though Flash can speed faster than the speed of light, atleast we now got a potential good race on our hands even if Sonic would have to fully power.

Comic Book Guy

07-30-2006, 03:35 PM

Thing is, I was talking about Sonic 3 & Knuckles. Is that what the Emeralds were called in that game? It's been years since I've played.

Super Sonic made his debut in Sonic 2.

Hyper Sonic -- more powerful than Super Sonic, thanks to the Super Emeralds -- made his debut in Sonic 3 when locked onto Sonic & Knuckles.

In a race or fight vs base Sonic I think it goes to the Flash,the guy outran death,TWICE!!

Yeah, I know. Outran him in Entropy too.

In a fight,I don't see how you can't give it to Super Sonic,he is broken beyond belief,I'd actually call him one of the strongest characters ever.He is up there with Dark Schiedner(sp?)and Marvel Cosmics.The guy takes on galaxy,no dimension destroying opponents,him and Hyper Knuckles are so strong they made a tear in the space-time continuum.

Yeah. Super Sonic is one of the most powerful characters in fiction, IMO. Hyper Knuckles and Chaos Knuckles are up there too. Super Shadow and Turbo Tails, maybe.

As far as a race if SS can't use Chaos Control then Flash can't steal speed.

Reasonable.

Gunners

07-30-2006, 03:38 PM

He did run in space, it was never explicitly stated that he couldn't, so it's not disproven.

When someone runs up in the air and is about to die before someone saves his ass, you assume they can not fly.

As for the issue numbers, I have a TPB which has the panels in it, but it doesn't state which issue precisely, only that the TPB is a compilation of the following issues:

So basically you do not know the actual circumstance you only have the issue without background knowledge?

Endless Mike

07-30-2006, 03:46 PM

No, I know the circumstances.

Imperiex was sending his probes to attack Earth, and the JLA was fighting them.

Comic Book Guy

07-30-2006, 03:48 PM

Flash racing in space is the JLA OWAW issue.

I'm re-reading it right now.

Gunners

07-30-2006, 03:53 PM

Ok, when you are done reading it could you explain to me, i don't really know what OWAW is. i will research.

Comic Book Guy

07-30-2006, 03:53 PM

OWAW stands for Our Worlds at War. It features Imperiex, the DC counterpart of Galactus, if you will.

OWAW is like a galactic war of Imperiex against Earth and Apokolips, if I remember correctly. It also features the (in)famous Superman sun-dip.

JLA OWAW is the issue where the scans come from. However, it doesn't show much. Right off the bat, you see Martian Manhunter incapacitated and Flash and GL Kyle taking on the rest (as you see in the scans). Even in the previous issue of Superman #172, it shows nothing of the JLA in space.

EM posted the 2 scans. The page after that is nothing much -- Imperiex immobilizes Flash, and that's it for Wally.

The 2 pages before that scan is a close-up on J'onn's mangled face, and then a 2 page 'splash' of J'onn among wreckage and GL Kyle to the upper right-hand corner defending himself from a blast from Imperiex. After that, in the 3rd page and 4th page of the issue, are the 2 scans EM posted.

So, unless I re-read the entire OWAW, there's not much I can clarify here.

Azure-kun

07-30-2006, 04:35 PM

uhh. . .sonic does start at the speed of sound none the less, but Light dash seems to Boost him big time. . .since the thread starter hasn't put Flash's copying Powers on hold I'll put my money on the Guy with the redspandex....

Way faster than The Flash.this is why everone calls you a joke

Comic Book Guy

07-30-2006, 04:40 PM

uhh. . .sonic does start at the speed of sound none the less, but Light dash seems to Boost him big time. . .since the thread starter hasn't put Flash's copying Powers on hold I'll put my money on the Guy with the redspandex....

I agree.

And it's not copying kinetic energy (how can you produce a copy of energy?). It's stealing kinetic energy.

Azure-kun

07-30-2006, 04:57 PM

It's stealing kinetic energy.

*blinks*. . .well that's a foul way to think of the flash, he still wins though so Yah...also I'd vote for sonic under terms of "being cool".

Comic Book Guy

07-30-2006, 05:01 PM

*blinks*. . .well that's a foul way to think of the flash,

Huh? Foul way?

he still wins though

Against base Sonic, yep.

Against Super Sonic. . . well, Super Sonic can go lightspeed. And as for stealing his speed, I'm not sure whether that will work, due to the nature of the Chaos Emeralds that empowers Sonic.

so Yah...also I'd vote for sonic under terms of "being cool".

Bingo.

Ion

07-30-2006, 05:07 PM

Super Sonic made his debut in Sonic 2.

Hyper Sonic -- more powerful than Super Sonic, thanks to the Super Emeralds -- made his debut in Sonic 3 when locked onto Sonic & Knuckles.Oh, I didn't know that he was called something different in Sonic & Knuckles 3.

Either way, in a race, I would go with the flash. In sheer coolness, Sonic gets this by a mile.