Kira Yamato vs. Shinn Asuka

[dspr8_rugged]

To those who are watching Gundam SEED and Destiny, I decided to put a separate topic to have your say about the highly anticipated battle between the protagonists of Gundam SEED and Destiny.

Who do you think will win the battle? Kira Yamato and his Freedom or Shinn Asuka and his Impulse (note: this is only an assumption...)?

Post your thoughts! :)

(PS: Oh yeah, no flaming, please.)

[kevin77]

Here is what I think is gonna happen: Kira arrives in Freedom, Shinn recognizes the Gundam that killed his parents and goes berserk. Shinn takes out the impulse and fight freedom. 5 sec later, impulse gets utterly pwned, explodes, and shinn gets the Destiny gundam.

[Chrno]

Kira will be the winner..come on if Shinn wins it will just mess up the series..I don't care if hes gundam has 5 nuclear bombs strapped onto it, Kira is the ultimate coordinator Shinn is just a pissed off kid.

[kevin77]

Kira will be the winner..come on if Shinn wins it will just mess up the series..I don't care if hes gundam has 5 nuclear bombs strapped onto it, Kira is the ultimate coordinator Shinn is just a pissed off kid.


Camille was also a pissed off kid at the start of Zeta, but he turned into my fav gundam character. Give Shinn a chance. He will understand his place in this universe....right after getting pwned by Kira that is! W00t!! :D

[Akirou]

It's a pretty close call, but I think that Kira's Freedom will win....only cuz Shinn is a pretty pissed off kid. But I wanna see what happens, I'ma give Shinn a chance, but I still think Kira pwns.

[Chillin]

Kira would beat the hell out of Shinn, and I imagine Kira schooling him in Freedom, and then him getting a new Gundam, but with that comes some sort of revelation from within Shinn, much like how it was when Kira got the Freedom. That being said, even though I'm not asked to predict the series here, I'm thinking Kira will beat the crap out of Shinn half way through the series, Shinn gets the new Gundam, but with that, he doesn't feel the need to fight Kira anymore

[TheWon]

I know Kira would Kill Shinn.
But I want Shinn to win. After seeing Episode 5. Shinn is becoming my favorite gundam character of all time. Heero move over!

[Praetorian]

Have to go with Kira on this one =) I don't really like Shinn regardless what happen to his family.

[absolutezero]

kira would probably win.... he has experience of fighting loads of times.... but at the same time.... kira hasn't fought for a while... whereas Shinn has.... hm.... and shinn has newer more advanced technology..... BUT kira knows how/ has used seed mode..... eh! oh well

[dspr8_rugged]

Well, we'll still have no idea whether Shinn has the SEED ability...

[darksage78]

Kira on this one all the way. Ultimate human pwns little whiner. lol

[kevin77]

Kira on this one all the way. Ultimate human pwns little whiner. lol


Well, isn't Kira the little whiner who was always complaining about piloting a gundam?

Shinn is more hot blooded than Kira imho.

[darksage78]

Well, isn't Kira the little whiner who was always complaining about piloting a gundam?

Shinn is more hot blooded than Kira imho.

lol yea... but Shinn gets on my nerves when he complains. Fine he's a little complainer. :D

[TheWon]

Dude Shinn has like mental problems now. For the past year he has been looking, listening and carrying a PINK PHONE! When he sees that blue and white gundam he is going to trip out.

[xenex]

The main characters are different??!! I must have been living under a rock because I honestly thought Shinn was Kira (then I noticed that Kira's gundam was in the air). Why did they make the characters look so similar (that blond girl that stole one of the gundams looked a lot like Cagali).

[absolutezero]

lol stellar? ... haha yeah Shinn and Kira they do look at first... but the eyes are completly different..... shinn's eyes are BLOOD RED!!!!!! =O...

[~K+]

It just occurred to me Shinn is alot like a male version of Flay...

[kevin77]

Actually all the characters have very similar faces. The guy who designed the characters probably just created one face, and put different hair cuts as well as different eye colors to make "different" characters.

[DeathWolf]

hmmm voted for kira

[dspr8_rugged]

Actually all the characters have very similar faces. The guy who designed the characters probably just created one face, and put different hair cuts as well as different eye colors to make "different" characters.
Yeah, I also noticed that all characters in Gundam SEED have the same set of eyes... :D

But we're off-topic that way.

Anyway... proceed. :)

[RurouniLeeO]

I think Kira would still win, but Shinn's new Gundam is just too Kickass. Maybe he'll win cuz his Gundam's so pro.

[kevin77]

Yeah, I also noticed that all characters in Gundam SEED have the same set of eyes... :D

But we're off-topic that way.

Anyway... proceed. :)


Whoops. Sry, I have tendencies of getting carried away when talking about Gundam.

Ok, seems like Shinn and his Impulse did not convince too many ppl throughout the first 5 episodes...

[Chopstickx]

i think kira will win the first time they fight. he has more experience than shinn and shinn seems like he has anger-management problems ...i think he will get better after he fights kira though :D

[xeleron]

Here is what I think is gonna happen: Kira arrives in Freedom, Shinn recognizes the Gundam that killed his parents and goes berserk. Shinn takes out the impulse and fight freedom. 5 sec later, impulse gets utterly pwned, explodes, and shinn gets the Destiny gundam.

--> Is there really going to be a destiny gundam??

[BladeZ]

Well Kira could fly around till Impulses batteries are low, then take out Shinn, coz although it hasn't become a problem yet the new Gundams don't have N Jammer cancellers I don't think.

But either way Kira is a better pilot, even Shinn aggreed in a way. Remeber he says 'So this is the power of the people at Yakin Dule, which means that he thinks that all Issac Asuran etc are great pilots. Also when you think about it Kira is the best out of all of them.

Kira is amazingly talented, we must remember he never recieved any Military training, and he is also the perfect Co-ordinator.

Shinn would get pwned.

[Yoruichi]

As much as I like Shinn, I have to say Kira. Freedom's like the ultimate Gundam of the Seed universe. :blink

[dspr8_rugged]

Sorry that the poll had to be ended so soon.

But as far as the poll is concerned, you guys said that Kira will kick Shinn's ass. :laugh

And I definitely agree.

Though maybe Shinn can also become a kick-ass pilot in the future...

[LOLZILLA]

I too think Kira would win. He has more skill, experience, and probably a better Gundam. It would be an intersting battle though.

[Raegan]

As much as I like Shinn, I have to say Kira. Freedom's like the ultimate Gundam of the Seed universe. :blink

Still it did have quite a difficult time with Gundam Providence.

And whatever happened to Justice? Did they ever explain its "disappearence"?

[PATMAN]

too late for me to vote:/ but kira would've won anyways =D

[Mindless]

I'd say Kira would win, simply because he is the Ultimate Cooridinator, the perfect human, and because he has the biggest-bad-ass-most-firepower-gundam in the series (so far).

As for Providence, what a lame Gundam. Having all thoes small laser-things flying around and just sitting back doing nothing. And remember, Kira had the Meteor attached to Freedom so it was probably a bit harder to handle.

As for Justice. Athrun drove it into the center of Genesis and self-detonated it and blew genesis up. Anyone who has watched the whole anime would know that. As for it surviving, not likely because Justice had a N-jammer too (nuclear reactor), detonation of that = nuclear explotion = nothing left.

EDIT: Can't wait to see some Athrun action in Saviour on monday. And it's a 40min special! :smile-big

PS: As for Shinn's Impulse beeing kickass? Pff... just a simple copy of Strike.

[g0su_newbie]

The small funnel thing are known as the DRAGOON system, only NEWTYPES (Note. NOT coordinators) can control it. It's another reason why Kira the ultimate coordinator had many problems with Providence, simply because Newtype > Coordinators.

[g0su_newbie]

P.S

Shinn is easily outmatched by Kira, then again Kira is THE ultimate coordinator with SEED mode activated.

SEED Shinn might have a chance with a better gundam though.

[kevin77]

The small funnel thing are known as the DRAGOON system, only NEWTYPES (Note. NOT coordinators) can control it. It's another reason why Kira the ultimate coordinator had many problems with Providence, simply because Newtype > Coordinators.


Yup, i'm an old shool gundam fan, so it's surprise if i agree with u that newtype > coordinators.

anyhow, ur name consititues quite an interesting oxymoron. Are u a Star caft fan?

[Chillin]

Hmm, I guess newtypes are better pilots than coordinators for the simple fact they can command much more advanced weaponry. In similar suits and similar ability, a coordinator on the genetic makeup level of Athrun or Lacus could probably beat a Char level newtype (he's not that powerful of a newtype). But let them get out of the mobile suits, then coordinators dominate for sure :P

[kevin77]

In similar suits and similar ability, a coordinator on the genetic makeup level of Athrun or Lacus could probably beat a Char level newtype (he's not that powerful of a newtype).

Blasmephy my friend, blasphemy! lol j/k. Well, the thing with newtypes is that they've got psychic abilities that allow them to "feel" stuff, "foresee" stuff and when they become emotionally unstable, they become super powerful (a little like seed mode but even more powerful).

For example, in Z Gundam, Camille became very angry and his laser saber actually became HUGE; a very manly symbolism for the least.

so if both had the same suit, i still think newtype would own in the very end.

[Chillin]

That is true, and Kamille was a very, very powerful Newtype. He had more potential than Amuro. From what I've seen of both Kira and Kamille though, in an all out fight, I see Kira winning because while Kamille has done some pretty impressive things. Kira just looked more impressive as a pilot. Maybe that was just because of the animation budget :laugh

[BattousaiMS]

first battle will go to Shinn, cuz Kira will refuse to fight him. But if they really are both into the fight, it's Kira Yamato hands down.

[Raegan]

I'd say Kira would win, simply because he is the Ultimate Cooridinator, the perfect human, and because he has the biggest-bad-ass-most-firepower-gundam in the series (so far).

As for Providence, what a lame Gundam. Having all thoes small laser-things flying around and just sitting back doing nothing. And remember, Kira had the Meteor attached to Freedom so it was probably a bit harder to handle.

As for Justice. Athrun drove it into the center of Genesis and self-detonated it and blew genesis up. Anyone who has watched the whole anime would know that. As for it surviving, not likely because Justice had a N-jammer too (nuclear reactor), detonation of that = nuclear explotion = nothing left.

EDIT: Can't wait to see some Athrun action in Saviour on monday. And it's a 40min special! :smile-big

PS: As for Shinn's Impulse beeing kickass? Pff... just a simple copy of Strike.

DAMN! I'm suffering from a serious memory block. I simply can't remember anything about any meteor or Genesis or Justice self-destructing. Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo........... ...........

[Jh1stgen]

Hands on fight: Kira
Mobile suit fight: Shin gets .....


































PWNED! :loool

[narutofan20052005]

kira would win, shinn is just a rookie while kira went and stopped the war with only a few allies where shinn can barley destroy anything

[crystalbluedragoon]

i think kira will win cos freedom has cool weapons and stuff (not saying that impulse doesn't) and its battery power lasts longer plus kira has piloted freedom longer than asuka has piloted impulse..and becos freedom is DA COOLEST!!

[Mindless]

Well, about Freedom having cool weapons is true but the purpose of them is firepower, right? Wich obviously the Impulse lacks in comparison. As for battery power; Freedom uses a thing called "N-Jammer Canceller" -or simply put, a nuclear reactor for power. Thus, the Freedoms weapon and movement fuelling is close to infinite, and will run as long as it's not blown up. And yes, Kira is obviously a superior pilot having expirienced countless battlefields and surviving the biggest of them all, Jakin Due. And the fact that he is the Ultimate Coordinator.

So the conclusion: Kira > Shinn

[Chillin]

Well the reason why ZAFT used a different power source for their mobile suits is because they had scattered N-Jammers onto Earth which makes nuclear weapons obsolete. Freedom and Justice were equipped with N-Jammer Cancellers, which allowed them to run on nuclear power without interference. So yeah, you're right...just had to spit my 2 pennies in there

[narutofan20052005]

yup, Freedom will win easily

[Hakuzo]

Kira would kick ass, no doubt about it.

[Kirarox]

Kira will beat Shinn easily because Kira used his skills plus the power of the Freedom.

[Gekigangar]

LOL. Way to go, bumping up such an old thread...

We all seen the Freedom vs Impulse Fight, and guess what? Impulse killed the all powerfull Freedom... =)

[Chibisuke89]

LOL ur right, but lets not forget the facts that kira was trying to escape, while shinn was out for blood. =P

If they were going head to head, 1 on 1 death match with nothing to lose, kira would definitly come out as the victory. =P

[Zetta]

Kira will beat Shinn easily because Kira used his skills plus the power of the Freedom.

Terrible post.

[Tachi67]

This Hand Of Mine Is Burning Red!!!!!

Anyways Kira owns Shinn. Shinn pisses me off anyways, and that fight where Freedom got destroyed by the Impulse wasn't even a real battle. Kira didn't even have the will to kill Shinn. Shinn wanted to kill Kira, so basically Kira wasn't trying.

[Red Zaku]

Anyways Kira owns Shinn.

Just not as far as the series goes or their actual skill is involved.

Shinn pisses me off anyways

No one cares. Or cares no one does.

,nd that fight where Freedom got destroyed by the Impulse wasn't even a real battle.

Nope, two pilots fighting each other in the midst of a war, definately not a real battle. Lol Wut?

Kira didn't even have the will to kill Shinn.

Not true, he tries to at least twice as many as 3 times. And not even Lightmaster was able to refute one of them.

Shinn wanted to kill Kira, so basically Kira wasn't trying.

>.> Bullshit. Kira basically wasn't trying. SEED Mode as defined by Fukuda is the physical representation of surpassing ones limits. So Kira was giving 110% in that fight but wasn't trying?

[Tachi67]

He went into Seed Mode to get this fight over with. Kira doesn't kill remember? He shoots the head, arms, or legs, and not the cockpit. His main objective was to try to get the Archangel escape the battle and go on. That battle Kira did not try to kill Shinn at all. So there you go, only Shinn was looking for blood.

[sazabi24]

He went into Seed Mode to get this fight over with. Kira doesn't kill remember? He shoots the head, arms, or legs, and not the cockpit. His main objective was to try to get the Archangel escape the battle and go on. That battle Kira did not try to kill Shinn at all. So there you go, only Shinn was looking for blood.

he lost in a superior suit. That makes him a worse pilot.

[Graham Aker]

and not the cockpit.
He swiped at the Impulse' cockpit with his beam saber.

[LightMaster]

Not true, he tries to at least twice as many as 3 times. And not even Lightmaster was able to refute one of them.

Sure I was, and so have others on other boards in other threads. That very same attack was used before to disable Yzak, and considering he'd never tried to kill Shinn before then or after then... it makes little sense. Deadpool on FAQs pointed out the ridiculousness of Kira telling the entire Arch Angel crew NOT to kill and then trying for it himself. Oh, and someone else on this very board posted up some image caps and a slow motion progression that showed it would have went through the hips and skirt.

[Calm]

Setsuna F. ! lulz i play.

Kira would have a better chance since he had his "trial by fire" in Gundam Seed so he was/is less emotional when it comes to a battle leading to a more clear minded approach in a battle. This can work to a disadvantage as well, meaning if he's not amped up to win, he can be over powered

[Red Zaku]

Sure I was, and so have others on other boards in other threads.

Except you never did. You said it wasn't a swipe at Impulses cockpit because it looked like this other time when Kira made it look like he'd kill Duel. Of course the huge problemw itht aht is, Kira wasn't getting his ass kicked, didn't have his back to the wall, and did a lot of things that werre totally different from how he finished off that attack with Duel. Thanks for failing again.

That very same attack was used before to disable Yzak,

You mean the one I already pointed out on, this topic no less, was nothing liek the one he took at Yzak? And that if hewa strying to disable Impulse he could have during that slash simply by doing what he ddi with Yzak and droppign his saber to destroy the legs? But then when deos Kira ever keep trying to disable when it doesn't work? Not against Rau, Not against Stella....... >.> hm.....


and considering he'd never tried to kill Shinn before then or after then...

Before then Kira was never in a situation where the lives of his sister and his friends aboard the AA weren't in danger, after then Kira was cocky as shit because he just got a new Gundam. >>>

it makes little sense.

Unless we look at the situation and circumstances of that fight.... Like normal rational people would....You know instead of generalizing well, " He never did it before or after." >.> Yeah show me where before, or after the AA was in a situation where Minerva was about to kill it and Kira if he beats SHinn might be able to do something to protect it?

Deadpool on FAQs pointed out the ridiculousness of Kira telling the entire Arch Angel crew NOT to kill and then trying for it himself.

>.> Except he does it with Rau, and with Stella.....


Oh, and someone else on this very board posted up some image caps and a slow motion progression that showed it would have went through the hips and skirt.

No they didn't. And if they did please provide it.

[LightMaster]

Except you never did. You said it wasn't a swipe at Impulses cockpit because it looked like this other time when Kira made it look like he'd kill Duel. Of course the huge problemw itht aht is, Kira wasn't getting his ass kicked, didn't have his back to the wall, and did a lot of things that werre totally different from how he finished off that attack with Duel. Thanks for failing again.

I said it wasn't a swipe because there's no reason to assume he'd suddenly try to kill Shinn then decide to suddenly never do it again In that fight. And that the Impulse opened up so wide any attempt to decide where the saber would have struck just from watching the scene will come off wrong.

But then when deos Kira ever keep trying to disable when it doesn't work? Not against Rau, Not against Stella....... >.> hm.....

Except against Rau he did it in a fit of rage because he'd killed Fllay, and he killed Stella because she was about to utterly erase Shinn. The Arch Angel was NOT about to be erased at the time, nor had Shinn just assassinated anyone close to Kira.

Before then Kira was never in a situation where the lives of his sister and his friends aboard the AA weren't in danger, after then Kira was cocky as shit because he just got a new Gundam. >>>

I'm speaking in terms of that fight, and no other. Considering again, he had several chances if he had wanted to simply end Shinn.

Except he does it with Rau, and with Stella....

Irrelevant, he'd never told the Arch Angel not to kill shit, or anyone else not to kill shit. He doesn't bother Athrun, Mwu, Dearka or the entire AA and Eternal Crew about killing. In THAT fight, he told the AA not to give ZAFT anything to use against them. That meant killing, etc, etc. There Isn't any other situation like this one.

[Lucaniel]

I'm fairly sure that Shinn is a better pilot, seeing as how he, you know, defeated Kira.

[skiboydoggy]

I'm fairly sure that Shinn is a better pilot, seeing as how he, you know, defeated Kira.
Handwaved away with WoG saying that Freedom's reactor having a leak and unable to reach full power or something like that.

[sazabi24]

Handwaved away with WoG saying that Freedom's reactor having a leak and unable to reach full power or something like that.

If the reactor was leaking, the moment kira left the suit, he would have been exposed to lethal amounts of radiation poisoning:zaru

[LightMaster]

If the reactor was leaking, the moment kira left the suit, he would have been exposed to lethal amounts of radiation poisoning:zaru

No he probably wouldn't have, every Mobile Suit probably has shielding in case of a reactor leak. In addition to whatever shielding a pilot suit may have.. not that I've ever heard of this reactor leak thing.

[Red Zaku]

I said it wasn't a swipe because there's no reason to assume he'd suddenly try to kill Shinn then decide to suddenly never do it again In that fight.

>.> Umm because he's not winning the fight and his friends whom he wants to protect are in danger. That's not a reason for Kira to take a cockpit shot or two if he fails the first time?


And that the Impulse opened up so wide any attempt to decide where the saber would have struck just from watching the scene will come off wrong.

>.> Hardly because you can screen cap where Impulse started and plice it with where Kira finished...


Except against Rau he did it in a fit of rage because he'd killed Fllay, and he killed Stella because she was about to utterly erase Shinn. The Arch Angel was NOT about to be erased at the time,

It was about to be erased by the Minerva which was pounding the damn thing.... >.> Who the hell cares if int he end it was fine? At the time Kira has no idea if it will be fine or not.... Precisely why he'd take a kill shot at Shinn.... Which he does....

nor had Shinn just assassinated anyone close to Kira.

No, Shinn was keeping Kira from returning the AA and potentially saving it fromthe Minerva. That's reason enough for Kira to drop his no kill policy he's done it for less a completely stranger as you so aptly pointed out...

I'm speaking in terms of that fight, and no other. Considering again, he had several chances if he had wanted to simply end Shinn.

He doesn't start out wanting to end Shinn but as the fitght goes on and the AA is in more and more danger, and SHinn just won't quit Kira is obviously getting frustrated hell yess he's going to take a cockpit shot.

Irrelevant, he'd never told the Arch Angel not to kill shit, or anyone else not to kill shit.

And? How does him telling someone not to kill change the fact he does kill? Ansd he'll do so for a complete stranger? Apparently he'll kill someone to protect Shinn, but not his biological sister?

He doesn't bother Athrun, Mwu, Dearka or the entire AA and Eternal Crew about killing.

>.> Ok, he still kills himself. ANd he's killed with much less motivation to do so then he has in this fight. And we've got instances of Kira attacking Shinn that look like cockpit shot attempts.... So he has motivation, and we've seen him take the opertunety. Becasue he failed miserably doesn't mean that's not what he was trying...

In THAT fight, he told the AA not to give ZAFT anything to use against them.

Except they'd already done that some fifteen episodes ago. Hell, they did when Kira shot the Tannahuser and killed all those Minerva crew members. It's a bit late for Kira to be saying that.... And he said that before the AA looked like it was going to be sunk.... Kira can't change his mind from the time the fight starts ot the time it looks like everyone he cares about save LAcus is going to die?

That meant killing, etc, etc. There Isn't any other situation like this one.

>.> You keep acting like Kira wouldn't change his mind when his sister, and friends were about to die.... which they were... You think Kira wouldn't re-consider killing Impulse at that point to save his friendS? I sure do.... So did the animators since they kinda made it look like Kira desided to take a cockpit shot on Shinn and Impulse...

==================

Handwaved away with WoG saying that Freedom's reactor having a leak and unable to reach full power or something like that.

Actually that wasn't used as an excuse for why Kira lost. that was used as an excuse for how Kira survived. That when Shinn's anti-ship sword impaled Freedom it's reactor didn't explode because Kira had managed to hit the reactor cut off....

[skiboydoggy]

His reactor didn't kill him and he couldn't push the Freedom to its max! Two plotholes with one handwave!

[LightMaster]

>.> Umm because he's not winning the fight and his friends whom he wants to protect are in danger. That's not a reason for Kira to take a cockpit shot or two if he fails the first time?

Not at all, considering he tells the Arch Angel not to do it so ZAFT doesn't go crazy with the propaganda. You still haven't really explained why he'd suddenly attempt for the kill exactly ONCE, then never do it again.

Hardly because you can screen cap where Impulse started and plice it with where Kira finished...

I've done that with my own caps... but if you have some, please post them.

It was about to be erased by the Minerva which was pounding the damn thing.... >.> Who the hell cares if int he end it was fine? At the time Kira has no idea if it will be fine or not.... Precisely why he'd take a kill shot at Shinn.... Which he does....


Not, it wasn't about to be erased by the Minerva, it wasn't about to be erased by anything until the Minerva decides to break out it's Positron Cannon- and he's not even dealing with Shinn at that point. He was already on his way back to the AA, minus a Wing and Rifle, and he wasn't nearly aggravated to the point that made him kill Rau, and Arch Angel wasn't in enough danger to make him kill-at least not based on previous examples.

No, Shinn was keeping Kira from returning the AA and potentially saving it fromthe Minerva. That's reason enough for Kira to drop his no kill policy he's done it for less a completely stranger as you so aptly pointed out...


A stranger who was in dire need of saving, the Arch Angel wasn't in dire need of saving at the time. It was still pretty much unscathed, and in no worse a situation then it had been when he started, or any other time he never tried to kill Shinn.

He doesn't start out wanting to end Shinn but as the fitght goes on and the AA is in more and more danger, and SHinn just won't quit Kira is obviously getting frustrated hell yess he's going to take a cockpit shot.

You're trying to compare his mild anger at Shinn not letting him go to the overall fury that made him Kill Rau? Simply put, there isn't one; Rau pushed him to the point where he'd rush him without any defense- Shinn never made him that angry because he couldn't...and Kira thusly never tried to kill him. Which is why Shinn's strategy worked so well... he'd have been in all kinds of shit if Kira had started to try and kill him.

And? How does him telling someone not to kill change the fact he does kill? Ansd he'll do so for a complete stranger? Apparently he'll kill someone to protect Shinn, but not his biological sister?

You're missing the point, it doesn't matter if he's killed Stellar before that episodes. THIS was a special case, and he knew it; normally he lets everyone else do their own thing...but he pretty much figured the whole point was to get them to attack and kill so ZAFT could paint them as terrible monsters. So he tells them to stow weapons and leave, no attacking and no killing. He has no choice but to defend himself, but why the hell would he decide to kill Shinn when even if he survives he'd pretty much fuck over his whole reason for being there.

Except they'd already done that some fifteen episodes ago. Hell, they did when Kira shot the Tannahuser and killed all those Minerva crew members. It's a bit late for Kira to be saying that.... And he said that before the AA looked like it was going to be sunk.... Kira can't change his mind from the time the fight starts ot the time it looks like everyone he cares about save LAcus is going to die?

15 episodes ago ZAFT wasn't recording the Arch Angel, like I said...special case. Which is why I'm not using times before or after for examples- none of them are LIKE Operation Angel Down. At all.

You keep acting like Kira wouldn't change his mind when his sister, and friends were about to die.... which they were... You think Kira wouldn't re-consider killing Impulse at that point to save his friendS? I sure do.... So did the animators since they kinda made it look like Kira desided to take a cockpit shot on Shinn and Impulse...


They weren't about to die when he DIDN'T try to kill Shinn, they were closer to DIVING then Dieing at the time.

His reactor didn't kill him and he couldn't push the Freedom to its max! Two plotholes with one handwave!

SCRAM =/= Plothole

[Red Zaku]

Not at all, considering he tells the Arch Angel not to do it so ZAFT doesn't go crazy with the propaganda.

Which doesn't rule out him doing it AFTER the AA is about to get blownup? Seems like Kira's sister's life being on the line plus the lives of everyone he knows on that ship being in danger might make him change his mind? Not to mention they already did that.... Let's face it Kira has already killed ZAFT personal by attackign the Tannhauser, killed some people when he shot the building to protect Lacus' escape to space.....


You still haven't really explained why he'd suddenly attempt for the kill exactly ONCE, then never do it again.

Because he's only in a situation where beating Shinn quickly gives him a chance to protect the AA and potentially save the lives of people he cares about once. Not before episode 34 or after 34 had the AA been in any kind of serious danger without some form of protection for it, whether that be Mwu, or the Dom Trio, in 34 it's just Kira and Kira can't do anything to help unless he beats Shinn, and as the AA comes closer and closer to destruction Kira gets more and more incentive to take a cockpit swing. Which is concurrent with his logic that to save innocent's and friends he'll take lives. The AA could be saved if Kira kills Shinn ends the fight and disables the Minerva.....

I've done that with my own caps... but if you have some, please post them.

Why would I need to post caps when talking about MOTIVATION? Not to mention you haven't posted jack shit, but I'll let that slide in the face of the fact I posted the entire link to the whole fight....From start to finish only one of two pages ago..... To point out how you were wrong in the order of events that transpired in this fight....

Not, it wasn't about to be erased by the Minerva, it wasn't about to be erased by anything until the Minerva decides to break out it's Positron Cannon-

The Archangel was getting pummeled by the Minerva and the ZAFT ships that ignored Glady's surrender offer....The Archangel getting shelled heavily by multiple ZAFT ships isn't in danger? >.> What?

and he's not even dealing with Shinn at that point. He was already on his way back to the AA, minus a Wing and Rifle, and he wasn't nearly aggravated to the point that made him kill Rau,

He was visibly frustrated just watch the fight, I already posted it. Not only was he visibly frustrated by the AA is in danger, and oh yeah, disabling doesn't work.... >.> Kira wasn't visibly frustrated, or super pissed when he killed Stella...

and Arch Angel wasn't in enough danger to make him kill-at least not based on previous examples.

Previous examples? Kira has carved off the bridges of ZAFT battleships with METEOR.... what was the threat level to anyone when he did that? Now the AA is getting pummeled, his friends could end up dead. That's not suitable motivation for Kira to kill?

A stranger who was in dire need of saving, the Arch Angel wasn't in dire need of saving at the time.

>.> The Archangel was getting pummelled by mutliple ZAFT land battleships,a nd the Minerva... That's pretty damn desparate especially when Kira hears Cagalli calling for him over the com....

It was still pretty much unscathed, and in no worse a situation then it had been when he started, or any other time he never tried to kill Shinn.

Save for the fact it was getting pummelled, disabling didn't work on Shinn, and Kira was starting to get his own ass kicked....I don't get how you can so downplay the AA is getting shelled by multiple ships and was being told to run the hell away by Kira himself.......I'd ask if you were always this bias but I know you are...

You're trying to compare his mild anger at Shinn not letting him go to the overall fury that made him Kill Rau?

No, I never once said that. I said Kira is visibly frustrated he can't beat Shinn, the longer he fights Shinn the less he can protect the AA he's already told the AA To run away because they are in trouble and they need to keep his sister safe. You don't think that compounded with the fact Kira's found he can't disable Impulse like a normal MS wouldn't inspire him to go for the cockpit? When he's gone for the cockpit on Stella because someone was in danger, and he couldn't take her down through disabling? Hell, Kira wasn't even as visibly frustrated against Stella as he is with Shinn...

You're missing the point, it doesn't matter if he's killed Stellar before that episodes. THIS was a special case, and he knew it;

Of course what he says at the start doesn't have to reflect how he feels later on after Shinn is proving impossible to finish off and the longer the fight drags on the more trouble the AA is getting into....Note at the begining of GSD Durandal wanted peaceful relations with Orb, by the end he's ordering Orb be blown up because they're attacking him..... If everyone stuck to what they said and never deviated in the slightest then D-man would have let Orb walk all over him for the sake of keeping peace...If everyone stuck to everything they said Cagalli and Athrun would have been married by the end of GSD....Just because Kira said it earliar doesn't mean he's going to stick to it now that the AA is indanger, and he's found disabling Shinn doesn't work....


15 episodes ago ZAFT wasn't recording the Arch Angel, like I said...special case.

It wasn't recording the AA for that battle either.

Which is why I'm not using times before or after for examples- none of them are LIKE Operation Angel Down. At all.

>.> Actually they were. Same level of media coverage of the actual battle. That is to say none.... The only thing special about Angel Down is that Kira is getting his ass kicked by Shinn, and he's getting pissed off, and the AA is in danger, which ramps up the longer Kira is tied up with Shinn giving Kira motivation to kill Shinn...

They weren't about to die when he DIDN'T try to kill Shinn, they were closer to DIVING then Dieing at the time.

They weren't even over water yet, they weren't over it until the Minerva was preparing to fire because diving operations have just begun. Sort of irrelevent as the AA was getting pounded badly enough Kira told them to run for it and leave him behind....And the AA is under increasingly heavy fire. You don't think Kira would kill SHinn to buy every possible second he could for the AA?

[LightMaster]

Which doesn't rule out him doing it AFTER the AA is about to get blownup?

The Arch Angel wasn't any closer to getting blown up then, then it was ten seconds earlier. Not to mention Kira has no way of knowing it's condition, since he has no way of seeing it; in addition to not trying to kill Shinn ever. The building he destroyed at the Airbase was a Radar Tower; it'd be utterly retarded for him to disable every single Mobile Suit there, and just spoke the Control Tower with a flyby and then just destroy some random building for shits and giggles.

Because he's only in a situation where beating Shinn quickly gives him a chance to protect the AA and potentially save the lives of people he cares about once.

Speaking strictly episode 34, are you unable to understand that. He has chances a plenty to end Shinn in episode 34 and he doesn't take them, so why does he suddenly take that one? Arch Angel was in just as much danger when he swung for the Impulses head and arm- but he didn't swing for the cockpit then. So why all of a sudden does he try.

Why would I need to post caps when talking about MOTIVATION?

Motivation is pointless without the actions, you said you had caps... so I asked you to post them. Simple, right?

The Archangel was getting pummeled by the Minerva and the ZAFT ships that ignored Glady's surrender offer....The Archangel getting shelled heavily by multiple ZAFT ships isn't in danger? >.> What?

You mean the shells that didn't manage to strike the actual ship? Or that trouble that they had been in when Kira could ahve struck Shinn down before then...but didn't. But suddenly decided he should for the shit of it.

Previous examples? Kira has carved off the bridges of ZAFT battleships with METEOR.... what was the threat level to anyone when he did that? Now the AA is getting pummeled, his friends could end up dead. That's not suitable motivation for Kira to kill?

... Kira never carved shit off anything with the METEOR, Athrun carved up stuff plenty. I'm pretty sure Kira never did though, pretty damned sure actually.

The Archangel was getting pummelled by mutliple ZAFT land battleships,a nd the Minerva... That's pretty damn desparate especially when Kira hears Cagalli calling for him over the com....

You're fucking making shit up, the comm was out. That's the exact reason why Kira didn't just tell the Arch Angel to get Cagalli to ORB as quickly as possible. Nice way to pull absolute crap out of your ass without knowing a damned thing about which you speak. Pummeled...they barely even get fucking hit.

No, I never once said that. I said Kira is visibly frustrated he can't beat Shinn, the longer he fights Shinn the less he can protect the AA he's already told the AA To run away because they are in trouble and they need to keep his sister safe.

You're pulling shit out of your ass AGAIN. He never told them to run because they were in trouble; they were leaving so ZAFT couldn't use them- llke Kira suspected they wanted to, and that's the reason the Arch Angel doesn't just fire back. Honestly...the Arch Angel could have fucked the Minerva's shit when they fly over her, but they didn't because that supposedly would have played into their hands... If Kira would have just allowed them to take out the Minerva...Shinn would have been fucked himself... not the point however. Just stop making up bullshit- and we'll be golden.

And he didn't go for a cockpit shot with Stellar, he stabbed into the cannons. The cockpit just exploded a little, she barely had any wounds for gods sake.

It wasn't recording the AA for that battle either.

Came off as kira thinking they were.

They weren't even over water yet, they weren't over it until the Minerva was preparing to fire because diving operations have just begun. Sort of irrelevent as the AA was getting pounded badly enough Kira told them to run for it and leave him behind....And the AA is under increasingly heavy fire. You don't think Kira would kill SHinn to buy every possible second he could for the AA?

He tells them to run well before that you idiot, the only people that keep going over the run thing are the Arch Angel's crew. I'm amazed really, that Kira knew his ship that wasn't in visual range, or contact with him was getting shelled-but not actually hit- and used it as motivation to kill Shinn...he MUST be a Newtype.

[Red Zaku]

The Arch Angel wasn't any closer to getting blown up then, then it was ten seconds earlier.

>.> So basically the archangel was never in danger ever, Kira's friends lives were never at stake and Kira was perfect? I'm starting to see this trend here, in your debates where you pretty much ignore everything to paint the picture you want painted.... Nevermind the AA is trying to run the fuck away because ZAFT will crush them.... Nevermind Kira is getting his asskicked and can't stop Shinn. >.> Apparently because Kira said one thing at the start of a fight he will not deviate from that at all.... The inane stupidity of that argument makes me so depressed I just want to weep fro humanity.....

[LightMaster]

>.> So basically the archangel was never in danger ever, Kira's friends lives were never at stake and Kira was perfect? I'm starting to see this trend here, in your debates where you pretty much ignore everything to paint the picture you want painted.... Nevermind the AA is trying to run the fuck away because ZAFT will crush them.... Nevermind Kira is getting his asskicked and can't stop Shinn. >.> Apparently because Kira said one thing at the start of a fight he will not deviate from that at all.... The inane stupidity of that argument makes me so depressed I just want to weep fro humanity.....

The Arch Angel was in danger, of course it was. The fact remains that Kira has no way of KNOWING that it's getting shelled or that any risk to it's safety has increased or decreased. The comm is out, which is why he sends a 'written' message instead of just the normal video chat. They never run because ZAFT will crush them, the Arch Angel could take the Minerva in a ship-to-ship battle easily-and it does so later-. The land Battle ship would be an even bigger cake walk if they ACTUALLY defended and returned fire. They're running because Kira told them to, because he figured ZAFT's whole point was to get them to slaughter them for propaganda.

[Zetta]

The Arch Angel was in danger, of course it was. The fact remains that Kira has no way of KNOWING that it's getting shelled or that any risk to it's safety has increased or decreased. The comm is out, which is why he sends a 'written' message instead of just the normal video chat. They never run because ZAFT will crush them, the Arch Angel could take the Minerva in a ship-to-ship battle easily-and it does so later-. The land Battle ship would be an even bigger cake walk if they ACTUALLY defended and returned fire. They're running because Kira told them to, because he figured ZAFT's whole point was to get them to slaughter them for propaganda.

Easily?

You mean after Mu destroyed the Tannhauser and stopped it's shot from one-shotting the ArchAngel? I don't call that easily.

I call that being lucky they had the Akatsuki. Gladys would have ended the ArchAngel then and there if Mu hadn't jumped in with his beam-deflecting mobile suit, deflected the shot and destroyed the Tannhauser later.

Do you even know anything about CE? Because you're not going to beat someone who rewatched it in it's entirety yesterday.

As for Shinn beating the Freedom. Yeah, Shinn knew the possible places Kira would have attacked. Doesn't change the fact that he dodged all his shot or deflected them without knowing wether Kira would aim for his head, arms or legs. All he knew is that he wasn't going to aim for the chest.

Don't forget that the Freedom has much better stats than the Impulse. There's no excuse. Kira just sucks at 1 on 1 combat.

Case in point: Battle Of Berlin. Kira fights the Destroy for a long time before the Minerva even appears. In this time, he did ZERO damage.
Bitch Yamato's beamspam didn't work on a mecha that wasn't jobbing.

Shinn comes in and beats the Destroy in two hits. Then talks Stella down. What does Kira do? He appears behind Shinn, causing Stella to freak out and then he kills the already totalled mecha.

Way to go Jesus Yamato, you fucking talentless hack. The guy is useless without an aimbot.

Another example is when he uses the Strike Rouge in space. Within the first couple minutes, he gets his arm and both of his legs shot off.
What's wrong Kira? Doesn't this mecha autotarget and fire pretty beams for you to spam?

What a talentless hack.

[Tranquil Fury]

Lightmaster seems to have forgotten Kira going "Such a...What is this" and his blaster gets destroyed to some effect he was frustrated the only time his saber connected was taking out Impulses's head, he failed every other time. Shinn beautifully and skillfully dodged all the attacks Kira threw even being very confident and blocking with his shield.

Did you miss the part where he tries to shoot and Shinn dodges and he shows a frustrated look as well? Did you miss the part where Shinn moves his mech's arm to dodge the laser perfectly?

Kira was up against someone who would'nt let him hit the weapons or the camera or any form of disabling and he had to beat this man yet you're saying he did'nt consider it important to try to kill? That makes him look even stupider.

Kira just barely dodged the Shield+Laser combo which barely hit his mech's shoulder as it passed and Kira himseld was shocked at that move. His expression shows that.

I saw Shinn take an inferior mech against a more experienced pilot who was in Seed as well and had reason enough to kill to save Cagalli and co. and still win.

Not our fault you see a different version of the fight.

[Zetta]

I like how this fight is basically a rehash of a fight that happened in the anime and Shinn owned hard but people still believe Jesus Yamato could win.

Nice job contradicting canon you dolts.

[Yukihiko Miroku]

Easily?


Shinn comes in and beats the Destroy in two hits. Then talks Stella down. What does Kira do? He appears behind Shinn, causing Stella to freak out and then he kills the already totalled mecha.

Way to go Jesus Yamato, you fucking talentless hack. The guy is useless without an aimbot.

Another example is when he uses the Strike Rouge in space. Within the first couple minutes, he gets his arm and both of his legs shot off.
What's wrong Kira? Doesn't this mecha autotarget and fire pretty beams for you to spam?

What a talentless hack.

:ryoma:rotfl

How can Zetta not be getting serious rep for this?? This pretty much raped the thread.

[Yukihiko Miroku]

Not our fault you see a different version of the fight.

I actually want to know which version of the fight he sees. Maybe I can see where he is coming from because apparently there is a Gundam Seed Destiny with alternate fights and Kira's skill is way above that in the version the rest of us has seen.

[LightMaster]

You mean after Mu destroyed the Tannhauser and stopped it's shot from one-shotting the ArchAngel? I don't call that easily.

You're a fucking idiot, trying to use a special incident as evidence that the Arch Angel couldn't have owned the Minerva right there at Operation Angel Down. Do you know WHY the Arch Angel didn't simply evade the Minerva's Positron Cannon; I'll give you a big fucking hint: If it did the Eternal would have gotten hit instead. Does it suddenly have the Eternal to protect during Angel down now?

I call that being lucky they had the Akatsuki. Gladys would have ended the ArchAngel then and there if Mu hadn't jumped in with his beam-deflecting mobile suit, deflected the shot and destroyed the Tannhauser later.

I call it being opportunistic in taking advantage of the fact that the Arch Angel isn't going to leave the Eternal to fry by avoiding the Positron Cannon itself.

Do you even know anything about CE? Because you're not going to beat someone who rewatched it in it's entirety yesterday.

Apparently I am, because I've already pointed out a whole in your shit already. Fine you watched it yesterday, watch it again and actually pay attention.

As for Shinn beating the Freedom. Yeah, Shinn knew the possible places Kira would have attacked. Doesn't change the fact that he dodged all his shot or deflected them without knowing wether Kira would aim for his head, arms or legs. All he knew is that he wasn't going to aim for the chest.

Which is why he would watch the Rifle to see where it's aiming before he fires, it's probably the common place method for evasion. Shinn could be faster about it because he knew if he was aiming in a general direction, he wasn't going to be aiming for the cockpit and only had to guess that it would be an arm, or the head or a leg. Fact that moving a limb out of the way is easier and faster then the body not-withstanding.

Don't forget that the Freedom has much better stats than the Impulse. There's no excuse. Kira just sucks at 1 on 1 combat.

No one ever calls the stats much better, and hush your shit up. Kira kicks ass at 1-on-1 combat. But I guess you have a point if you ignore him beating Athrun in Destiny, forcing Rey to save Shinn, kicking Shinn around in Space, beating Rey... Oh, and fighting the druggies back in SEED. Fighting Athrun back in SEED... Fuck, let's just ignore anything contrary to your point.

Case in point: Battle Of Berlin. Kira fights the Destroy for a long time before the Minerva even appears. In this time, he did ZERO damage.
Bitch Yamato's beamspam didn't work on a mecha that wasn't jobbing.

He fights the Destroy, Chaos and Mwu's Windam before the Minerva arrives. Let's just ignore the fact that the Destroy actually works with it's two Guards to keep the Freedom away, using it's DRAGOON hands, and Chaos.

Shinn comes in and beats the Destroy in two hits. Then talks Stella down. What does Kira do? He appears behind Shinn, causing Stella to freak out and then he kills the already totalled mecha.

He doesn't get two hits, he gets one and he doesn't beat the Destroy with the one hit he gets. He cuts open it's cockpit and the Destroy isn't phased in the least. Notice how when Kira decides he wants to engage in melee Stellar suddenly becomes competent again and uses her shield to ward off his slash and her finger cannons to make him back off. When Shinn decides to rush in her aim suddenly becomes shit, she can't use her DRAGOON hands and she doesn't know how to use a shield to save her life. Last but not least, don't fault Kira for just floating there being non-threatening, and I won't blame Stellar for being an irrational, fucked out of her mind crazy bitch.

Another example is when he uses the Strike Rouge in space. Within the first couple minutes, he gets his arm and both of his legs shot off.
What's wrong Kira? Doesn't this mecha autotarget and fire pretty beams for you to spam?

Yes, because it was either lost his arm and stop fighting. Or lose the Eternal and keep fighting for NO FUCKING reason. The simple fucking fact of the matter is, in Strike Rouge a fairly fucking out dated Mobile Suit, he shot the shit out of ZAKU's and GOUF's. He doesn't need a special targeting computer to shoot of your head, and your limbs. He absolutely doesn't, and he proved it. He shot off a ZAKU's head, A GOUF's arm and that same GOUF's head in succession. He can still hit the broadside of an ant with his rifle, Freedom or no Freedom.

Fucking get over it, or stop fucking talking about it.

Lightmaster seems to have forgotten Kira going "Such a...What is this" and his blaster gets destroyed to some effect he was frustrated the only time his saber connected was taking out Impulses's head, he failed every other time. Shinn beautifully and skillfully dodged all the attacks Kira threw even being very confident and blocking with his shield.

So suddenly this is aggravation on the level of what it took to make him kill Rau. It's not, because he was litterally furious at Rau it got to the point where he put everything on the line to rush him with a Saber; THAT'S how angry Kira was when he tried to kill Rau. He never got so angry when it came to Shinn. Oh, and considering Kira only swung his saber and missed... once? You're overplaying his supposed failure with the Saber.

Did you miss the part where he tries to shoot and Shinn dodges and he shows a frustrated look as well? Did you miss the part where Shinn moves his mech's arm to dodge the laser perfectly?

...No, I didn't miss it. I don't understand why you think I did.

Kira was up against someone who would'nt let him hit the weapons or the camera or any form of disabling and he had to beat this man yet you're saying he did'nt consider it important to try to kill? That makes him look even stupider.

Didn't let him hit the weapons and camera? He sure as fuck did hit a Camera and a pretty damned important arm. If you mean with the Rifle, you're right. It still fucking escapes me how Kira forget he had four other guns to pin Shinn down with. PIS, probably. But it's a TV show so it's to be expected.

Kira just barely dodged the Shield+Laser combo which barely hit his mech's shoulder as it passed and Kira himseld was shocked at that move. His expression shows that.

Of course he's fucking shocked, he didn't even know the Impulse had EDA. If he had would he be shocked at it being able to deflect beams...fuck no, he was seeing EDA before Shinn had even seen a Mobile Suit fly.

I saw Shinn take an inferior mech against a more experienced pilot who was in Seed as well and had reason enough to kill to save Cagalli and co. and still win.

And he used the inferior mech well, don't miss understand what I'm saying. The simple fact of the matter is, Kira never came off as being angry enough to kill anyone. If he had wanted to kill Shinn, why didn't he try for it again at the very end of the fight?

I like how this fight is basically a rehash of a fight that happened in the anime and Shinn owned hard but people still believe Jesus Yamato could win.

Except in this fight Kira's going to use all his guns, do more then just lock blades... if he needs to he's going to use dual sabers, his shield smash, etc, etc. The difference is here, there isn't any plot, or character induced stupidity limiting what they do. Also, does Shinn have the Minerva to resupply him? If not...it's not a rehash and he'd lose the second he went for that swing and Kira drops the Freedom under and takes the Impulses right arm and head.

[Tranquil Fury]

So suddenly this is aggravation on the level of what it took to make him kill Rau. It's not, because he was litterally furious at Rau it got to the point where he put everything on the line to rush him with a Saber; THAT'S how angry Kira was when he tried to kill Rau. He never got so angry when it came to Shinn. Oh, and considering Kira only swung his saber and missed... once? You're overplaying his supposed failure with the Saber.

:facepalm, he does'nt need to be angry to kill Shinn, he can't beat someone with disabling and is being pushed back and you're telling me he has no reason to kill to save his loved ones? . What you're saying is Kira was'nt giving everything to beat Shinn at all costs because nothing was on the line for him to care enough? You're saying Kira has to wait for his friends to die before getting serious when he could avoid that and kill? Disabling was'nt going to be enough for that battle and it was obvious.

No, I didn't miss it. I don't understand why you think I did.

Because you seem to think Shinn did'nt beat Kira fairly and that knowing about Kira's Disabling somehow taints his victory and makes everything else he did from dodging to beating Kira unfair.

Didn't let him hit the weapons and camera? He sure as fuck did hit a Camera and a pretty damned important arm. If you mean with the Rifle, you're right. It still fucking escapes me how Kira forget he had four other guns to pin Shinn down with. PIS, probably. But it's a TV show so it's to be expected.

Only because Shinn was arrogant, he could replace parts so this was'nt a problem and if you're asking why Kira did'nt use the four others it was because Shinn Brilliantly kamikazed parts onto Kira so he could'nt, Do also note Shinn is'nt going to let Kira do anything, he's smart enough to know what Kira can do especially since he'd seen Kira use those 4 rifles to take out fodder.

Of course he's fucking shocked, he didn't even know the Impulse had EDA. If he had would he be shocked at it being able to deflect beams...fuck no, he was seeing EDA before Shinn had even seen a Mobile Suit fly.

You're still ignoring the part he barely dodged the attack as it almost passed his mech's shoulder, pretty good shooting from Shinn eh?

And he used the inferior mech well, don't miss understand what I'm saying. The simple fact of the matter is, Kira never came off as being angry enough to kill anyone. If he had wanted to kill Shinn, why didn't he try for it again at the very end of the fight?

You don't understand yourself, Kira did'nt have to be angry to kill, he had to for a greater good and that was save his loved ones, are you saying Kira would'nt for such a reason? He did try as well but then you kept bringing up some other scene saying they were similar, remember when Kira tries to go for the cockpit and Impulse separates and he's shocked at how Impulse can do that?

Except in this fight Kira's going to use all his guns, do more then just lock blades... if he needs to he's going to use dual sabers, his shield smash, etc, etc. The difference is here, there isn't any plot, or character induced stupidity limiting what they do. Also, does Shinn have the Minerva to resupply him? If not...it's not a rehash and he'd lose the second he went for that swing and Kira drops the Freedom under and takes the Impulses right arm and head.

Then Shinn will be less arrogant and more carefuly knowing he has no supply.

And since you keep bringing this up again let me remind you:

-Kira had to save his loved ones
-He was in Seed mode
-Shinn was'nt going to give up till he killed Kira
-Shinn was not going to allow for disabling
-Kira was frustrated

He does'nt need to be angry to have a reason to kill, saving his loved ones should do. There is no excuse for Kira, don't even try.

[Zetta]

You're a fucking idiot, trying to use a special incident as evidence that the Arch Angel couldn't have owned the Minerva right there at Operation Angel Down. Do you know WHY the Arch Angel didn't simply evade the Minerva's Positron Cannon; I'll give you a big fucking hint: If it did the Eternal would have gotten hit instead. Does it suddenly have the Eternal to protect during Angel down now?
Yes, that's called superior tactics.

The Minerva is a superior ship run by a superior Captain. In every encounter, Talia Gladys has shown herself to a good captain and possibly the CE version of Noah Bright if she had smacked Athrun once or twice.

That's what we call superiority. The Tanhauser could have oneshotted ArchAngel and Gladys brought them in a situation where they couldn't dodge.

Just accept the fact that Talia Gladys is just overal better than Murrue Ramius.


I call it being opportunistic in taking advantage of the fact that the Arch Angel isn't going to leave the Eternal to fry by avoiding the Positron Cannon itself.

Oh no, the Minerva outflew us. :uwah

So opportunistic. You'd think we were in OPEN WAR or something :cry :cry


Apparently I am, because I've already pointed out a whole in your shit already. Fine you watched it yesterday, watch it again and actually pay attention.

You mean how Gladys is superior to Ramius? Well, that was obvious :awesome

Which is why he would watch the Rifle to see where it's aiming before he fires, it's probably the common place method for evasion. Shinn could be faster about it because he knew if he was aiming in a general direction, he wasn't going to be aiming for the cockpit and only had to guess that it would be an arm, or the head or a leg. Fact that moving a limb out of the way is easier and faster then the body not-withstanding.

Which means Shinn is skilled enough to deduce the target of attacks by careful observation of the enemy.

In short, he has skills. Something Yamato lacks.

No one ever calls the stats much better, and hush your shit up. Kira kicks ass at 1-on-1 combat. But I guess you have a point if you ignore him beating Athrun in Destiny, forcing Rey to save Shinn, kicking Shinn around in Space, beating Rey... Oh, and fighting the druggies back in SEED. Fighting Athrun back in SEED... Fuck, let's just ignore anything contrary to your point.

Yeah.

Let's take this for a second.

1. Athrun. Athrun only fought Kira seriously once. And guess who got the Aegis blown up their face and needed plot to save them. Not Athrun. Jobber Yamato.

2. The Extended in Seed? You mean Clotho, Shani and Orga. And you mean how Clotho and Shani were BOTH taken out by Yzak while Orga was taken out by Athrun? :ryoma

The great Kira Yamato was unable to kill the druggies. Let's not forget that his only extended kill was Stellar, whose mecha had been totalled by Shinn earlier. What a pathetic pilot.

3. Kicking Shinn around? You mean how he was too busy dodging the beamspam from Legend and Athrun had to save him? :lmao

4. Beating Legend? It was even fucking shown that Rey hesitated because Kira yelled that Rey didn't have to live his life for either Rau or Durandal.
So he can only beat fodders, Gundams disabled by actual worthwhile pilots (Shinn) and people he makes hesitate. Wow, skills :ryoma

5. Beating Athrun? You mean how Athrun wasn't attacking him and Kira went Seed in order to total the Savior? :ryoma


He fights the Destroy, Chaos and Mwu's Windam before the Minerva arrives. Let's just ignore the fact that the Destroy actually works with it's two Guards to keep the Freedom away, using it's DRAGOON hands, and Chaos.
Yeah, and Chaos was taken out by mooks in Murasame's.

Kira Yamato wasn't able to do what ORB fodder did. All he beat there was Mu's Windam, which has pathetic stats compared to Chaos, Destroy and Freedom.

Kira Yamato, the destroyer of fodder suits :ryoma


He doesn't get two hits, he gets one and he doesn't beat the Destroy with the one hit he gets. He cuts open it's cockpit and the Destroy isn't phased in the least. Notice how when Kira decides he wants to engage in melee Stellar suddenly becomes competent again and uses her shield to ward off his slash and her finger cannons to make him back off. When Shinn decides to rush in her aim suddenly becomes shit, she can't use her DRAGOON hands and she doesn't know how to use a shield to save her life. Last but not least, don't fault Kira for just floating there being non-threatening, and I won't blame Stellar for being an irrational, fucked out of her mind crazy bitch.


And notice how Kira was only able to get a hit in when Stella snapped. Shinn was able to get TWO of them in while she was still normal.

The superior pilot is obvious.


Yes, because it was either lost his arm and stop fighting. Or lose the Eternal and keep fighting for NO FUCKING reason. The simple fucking fact of the matter is, in Strike Rouge a fairly fucking out dated Mobile Suit, he shot the shit out of ZAKU's and GOUF's. He doesn't need a special targeting computer to shoot of your head, and your limbs. He absolutely doesn't, and he proved it. He shot off a ZAKU's head, A GOUF's arm and that same GOUF's head in succession. He can still hit the broadside of an ant with his rifle, Freedom or no Freedom.

Yeah, he was able to hit Zaku's and Goufs in space when the pilots didn't expect the fucking legendary Strike. The mecha that helped end the last war.

Great job, he was able to beat fodders and STILL get his Strike ruined.

What a talentless hack :awesome

Except in this fight Kira's going to use all his guns, do more then just lock blades... if he needs to he's going to use dual sabers, his shield smash, etc, etc. The difference is here, there isn't any plot, or character induced stupidity limiting what they do. Also, does Shinn have the Minerva to resupply him? If not...it's not a rehash and he'd lose the second he went for that swing and Kira drops the Freedom under and takes the Impulses right arm and head.
This fight happened.

Shinn was the superior pilot and he beat a superior mecha. Rey and Shinn constantly mention during their research that Freedom is more powerful than Impulse.

It's not the mecha that decides the battle. Something Failure Yamato found out first hand as the sword went into his cockpit.

What a failure.

[LightMaster]

Yes, that's called superior tactics.

The Minerva is a superior ship run by a superior Captain. In every encounter, Talia Gladys has shown herself to a good captain and possibly the CE version of Noah Bright if she had smacked Athrun once or twice.

That's what we call superiority. The Tanhauser could have oneshotted ArchAngel and Gladys brought them in a situation where they couldn't dodge.

Just accept the fact that Talia Gladys is just overal better than Murrue Ramius.

It is, but situational at best, and the situation isn't present at Operation Angel Down. However the tactics used to disable the Minerva's Launch Catapults and Tristan Beam Cannon's could have been duplicated more or less when the Arch Angel flies over the Minerva during Angel Down. The simple fact is, the Arch Angel is the better Ship. And Murrue showed good Ship-to-ship tactics by... well, the above.

So opportunistic. You'd think we were in OPEN WAR or something

Ok, let me be frank. The one time they were going to hit the Arch Angel with the cannon in an actual fight. It was because the Arch Angel was to protect the Eternal. This situation can't be recreated at Operation Angel down, and is thus...a moot point. Arch Angel > Minerva, better design and better tactics. Want to be technical? Arch Angel caused tons more damage to the Minerva so...yeah.

You mean how Gladys is superior to Ramius? Well, that was obvious

Murrue > Gladys since Murrue caused more damage to Glady's ship. Disabling both of it's Beam Cannons, and it's catapults. I guess Glady's blew off one of the Arch Angel's Beam Cannons...but kind of paltry by comparison.

In short, he has skills. Something Yamato lacks.

Aside from Kira doing more in the way of dodging, deflecting beams with his sabers. Chopping off limbs with high speed passes, shooting off limbs without the multi-targeting computer etc, etc...full of it yet again. Oh, and sword catching.

1. Athrun. Athrun only fought Kira seriously once. And guess who got the Aegis blown up their face and needed plot to save them. Not Athrun. Jobber Yamato.

Athrun had to blow up the Aegis, clearly the superior pilot. Fact that Athrun needed plot to keep Kira from cutting him clear of his chest not withstanding. Oh, and don't forget how Kira utterly owned Athrun in Destiny.

2. The Extended in Seed? You mean Clotho, Shani and Orga. And you mean how Clotho and Shani were BOTH taken out by Yzak while Orga was taken out by Athrun?

Druggies =/= Extended, two different forms of augmentation. And who said he killed them, I said he was good at 1-on-1, that doesn't mean he kills them. Still did very well against all three of them together, and individually.

The great Kira Yamato was unable to kill the druggies. Let's not forget that his only extended kill was Stellar, whose mecha had been totalled by Shinn earlier. What a pathetic pilot.

He wouldn't have killed the druggies anyway you idiot, so expecting him to is...

Anyway, you don't measure skill in kills. He has all of...two kills after getting Freedom. By choice, so it's not a question of skill before you try such a stupid alternative. Disabled Mwu, Auel, Stellar(who he latter killed); Killed Rau, utterly destroyed Saviour AFTER he damn near did the same to Chaos. Knocked Shinn around in Destiny, and Rey. Etc, etc. Before then he was just fine beating up Athrun;s team, Andy and so on.

3. Kicking Shinn around? You mean how he was too busy dodging the beamspam from Legend and Athrun had to save him?

Actually no, I meant when he kicked Shinn down and was poised to disable the shit out of him before Rey had to come and safe Shinn. See how you ignore what happened FIRST to try and discredit Kira, kind of a shit way to roll. Also in space when Kira used the DRAGOON's to bounce Shinn around before knocking him about some more with a swing by off the ol' Alpha Strike.

4. Beating Legend? It was even fucking shown that Rey hesitated because Kira yelled that Rey didn't have to live his life for either Rau or Durandal.
So he can only beat fodders, Gundams disabled by actual worthwhile pilots

Yes, because Kira wasn't all shook up about Rey supposedly being Rau. Hurrah for jack-asses Double Standards! He beat Legend, they both fucked with each others heads, it wasn't something just one of them did. The difference is Rey couldn't fuck with Kira enough to do any worthwhile damage. Kira of course...could.

5. Beating Athrun? You mean how Athrun wasn't attacking him and Kira went Seed in order to total the Savior?

Yes... because Athrun didn't rush Kira too. No, he sat there and let Kira rush him...didn't attack AT ALL. Yep...Animation is totally incorrect, because Athrun didn't attempt to hit Kira with a shield smash...and then got it totally countered because Kira is a totally crap pilot unable to read the flow of battle- despite anticipating Athrun's intentions, and the dozens or so other times he's done similar.

Yep. You're right.



/Sarcasm

Yeah, and Chaos was taken out by mooks in Murasame's.

Kira Yamato wasn't able to do what ORB fodder did. All he beat there was Mu's Windam, which has pathetic stats compared to Chaos, Destroy and Freedom.

Not regular mooks, they had names; and were part of the Arch Angel crew. Plus there was three of them, and Kira didn't ever JUST fight Chaos. So...yeah, your point remains moot because you have no idea what happened and thus...what you're talking about. But to be fair, I'll tell you how Kira had to fight Chaos and Destroy's DRAGOON hands and again...Mwu. He distracts Destroy when the Murasame's take on the Chaos.

Nice to know you watched Destiny yesterday btw.

And notice how Kira was only able to get a hit in when Stella snapped. Shinn was able to get TWO of them in while she was still normal.

The superior pilot is obvious.

One hit, he hit once. Can you count? He slashed her cockpit, unless we're counting hits that don't puncture the Destroy's armor or otherwise bother it...then Kira got shit tons more hits though. And again... Shinn was able to get in one hit when Stellar suddenly got shitty. Even when Shinn was just flying straight she didn't manage to hit him, didn't ever decide he needed to have the DRAGOON's put to him... or that the hand cannons would probably be better for point defense.

Yeah, he was able to hit Zaku's and Goufs in space when the pilots didn't expect the fucking legendary Strike. The mecha that helped end the last war.

Great job, he was able to beat fodders and STILL get his Strike ruined.

What a talentless hack

Ah... so you're trolling again? Because your explanation makes exactly zero sense. What does the Strike being there have to do with him hitting arms, heads and cannons without the targeting computer he supposedly needs?

He got the Strike ruined because he had to keep the Eternal from getting shot up. If he had been earlier, not so the case... but since the Eternal had been taking beams for a while it probably didn't have any coating left...thus.

[Zetta]

Lightmaster: Looking for explanations to make Kira look good in situations where he failed. :ryoma

[Yukihiko Miroku]

It's not the mecha that decides the battle. Something Failure Yamato found out first hand as the sword went into his cockpit.

What a failure.

I wonder if Failure Yamato is Zetta's new name for Kira!