Goku (DBZ not GT) vs War Hulk

[Bullet]

Quite funny thing though- Everyone agree's that Kid Buu is far superior to Hulk
and Goku beat Kid Buu,
but Goku cannot beat Hulk

Why is that?

SSJ3 Goku never came close to beating Kid Buu, he had to take a rest because ssj3 transformation was taking up way to much energy. He couldn't continue fighting so Vegeta took his place while he rested up (but he still was losing power). Kid Buu is equal to an ssj3 Goku, who could barely lift halve a city, Hulk takes punches from beings that crush planets and stars with his bare hands; Goku stands no chance if he can't even take punches from some body whos on the level of a ssj3. Every attack ssj3 Goku throws him he won't feel it, if he gets hurt he'll heal from in seconds.

This is the guy Hulk fought and defeated.

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/4975/destroyingworld4gu.jpg

That's Gladiator in that scan, he destroyed a star with a single strike. Hulk hits Goku one time and it's over.

[azn_sephiroth]

SSJ3 Goku never came close to beating Kid Buu, he had to take a rest because ssj3 transformation was taking up way to much energy. He couldn't continue fighting so Vegeta took his place while he rested up (but he still was losing power). Kid Buu is equal to an ssj3 Goku, who could barely lift halve a city, Hulk takes punches from beings that crush planets and stars with his bare hands; Goku stands no chance if he can't even take punches from some body whos on the level of a ssj3. Every attack ssj3 Goku throws him he won't feel it, if he gets hurt he'll heal from in seconds.

This is the guy Hulk fought and defeated.

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/4975/destroyingworld4gu.jpg

That's Gladiator in that scan, he destroyed a star with a single strike. Hulk hits Goku one time and it's over.

I think I learned my lesson in this thread after reading the "Something to remember in comic book matchups" thread, and read what moderator "reznor" says.

http://forums.narutofan.com/showthread.php?t=35062

Goku...shouldn't be in any type of battle thread, since alot of people will agree it's litteraly "over kill" for anything, besides God, (mythology gods, demi-gods etc)

But for you FANBOYS out there, just don't seem to get it heh?...

Anyways...thats what I think..feel free to flame me.

Btw Kamendex you get reps from me ^_^

[Bullet]

I think I learned my lesson in this thread after reading the "Something to remember in comic book matchups" thread, and read what moderator "reznor" says.

http://forums.narutofan.com/showthread.php?t=35062

Goku...shouldn't be in any type of battle thread, since alot of people will agree it's litteraly "over kill" for anything, besides God, (mythology gods, demi-gods etc)

But for you FANBOYS out there, just don't seem to get it heh?...

Anyways...thats what I think..feel free to flame me.

Btw Kamendex you get reps from me ^_^

I think your the fanboy (DBZ/GT) for putting something up like that. The DBZ/GT characters aren't that powerful, and can be defeated by lots of characters.:cool

[Dark Shadow]

Yeah...they only win by some stupid transformation

War Hulk.....Goku can't cut it in terms of strength, speed, and possibly power

[azn_sephiroth]

I think your the fanboy (DBZ/GT) for putting something up like that. The DBZ/GT characters aren't that powerful, and can be defeated by lots of characters.:cool

Ok....so I'm a fanboy because I agree to what a moderator said right? Did you even go the link? Probably didn't heh....
.
Look kid....I only put that up to tell people something. I do LIKE dbz.. but I don't like it as much as bleach, or Naruto. And Yes Dbz characters can be beat by 1 character only..Akira Toriyama ^_^

And Junidaime made a good point about
GOKU
Silver Surfer
God
Super Man
etc... are too overpowered too have "sane" debates on

Geeze...

Whoever made this thread I give reps to*

[tdultima]

if cell could destroy the solar system then ssj3 goku would be way beyond that

it doesn't matter if hulk is strong

he won't survive dbz planet busting beams

[Zouri]

I don't remember Cell being able to destroy a solar system. And SSJ3 Goku is WEAKER than Kid Buu. He couldn't beat him and he ended the fight with a Spirit Bomb.

War Hulk has him beat 8-ways to Sunday.

[Tsukiyomi]

Did any villain ever do more than destroy a single planet at a time? Think about how much space is between each planet in a solar system, that would have to be an unimaginable explosion.

[Bullet]

if cell could destroy the solar system then ssj3 goku would be way beyond that

it doesn't matter if hulk is strong

he won't survive dbz planet busting beams

Cell isn't close to destroying Solar Systems. :nono

[azn_sephiroth]

Cell isn't close to destroying Solar Systems. :nono

I'm actually agreeing with you.

Cell is strong...but HE CAN'T destroy solar systems.

I dont think goku could've beat cell.....cause he let Gohan go for him.

Ultimately...i think cell can beat war hulk, but he can't beat ssj3 goku.

[Bullet]

Ok....so I'm a fanboy because I agree to what a moderator said right? Did you even go the link? Probably didn't heh....
.
Look kid....I only put that up to tell people something. I do LIKE dbz.. but I don't like it as much as bleach, or Naruto. And Yes Dbz characters can be beat by 1 character only..Akira Toriyama ^_^

And Junidaime made a good point about
GOKU
Silver Surfer
God
Super Man
etc... are too overpowered too have "sane" debates on

Geeze...

Whoever made this thread I give reps to*

Maybe the moderator needs to watch more DBZ/GT because they aren't that powerful. And every body on that list can be defeated by other characters aswell (God not included). :smile-big

[Zouri]

Wait, Cell beat War Hulk. There's no way that's happening. War Hulk is too strong for Cell to even touch him. War Hulk is just way to powerful, and SSJ3 doesn't last as long as people think. It's 15 min at most I think. In either case, even if both were to gang up on him I'm pretty sure War Hulk would come out on top.

[azn_sephiroth]

Maybe the moderator needs to watch more DBZ/GT because they aren't that powerful. And every body on that list can be defeated by other characters aswell (God not included). :smile-big

You obviously didn't go to the link. And I bet the mod watched ALL the dbz episodes.....

I told you...one person can only beat DBZ characters. And thats akira toriyama!

God can destroy anything so i cant include him in this.

[Tsukiyomi]

Ultimately...i think cell can beat war hulk, but he can't beat ssj3 goku.

Uh huh, and what are you basing that off of? What is Cell going to do to him? Hulk's healing power is beyond Cell's, Maestro came back from being reduced beyond atoms. Cell needs a full cell (and his cells are quite big as I recall).

In terms of physical strength the DBZ guys aren't all that impressive and with War Hulks sword putting him in the celestial range of power he could probably stand up to any energy blasts the DBZ guys can cook up. Apocalypse seemed confident War Hulk could take on a Celestial being, Marvels Celestial beings make DBZ characters look like nothing.

DBZ characters are horrendously over-rated. Give me one example of a DBZ character destroying more than a single planet. They've never done it and I don't think they can destroy more than one at a time. There are numerous Marvel and DC characters capable of destroying universes with a thought, so don't think too highly of DBZ guys.

[Bullet]

Uh huh, and what are you basing that off of? What is Cell going to do to him? Hulk's healing power is beyond Cell's, Maestro came back from being reduced beyond atoms. Cell needs a full cell (and his cells are quite big as I recall).

In terms of physical strength the DBZ guys aren't all that impressive and with War Hulks sword putting him in the celestial range of power he could probably stand up to any energy blasts the DBZ guys can cook up. Apocalypse seemed confident War Hulk could take on a Celestial being, Marvels Celestial beings make DBZ characters look like nothing.

DBZ characters are horrendously over-rated. Give me one example of a DBZ character destroying more than a single planet. They've never done it and I don't think they can destroy more than one at a time. There are numerous Marvel and DC characters capable of destroying universes with a thought, so don't think too highly of DBZ guys.

Nicely put!:cool :smile-big :kaiten

[azn_sephiroth]

What is Cell going to do to him.

He's gonna rape him and steal his sword....what else is he gonna do to him? Seriously man I think cell can beat war hulk haha.

And I'm basing it off What I've seen cell do. ^_^

By the way tskuyomi it's funny what you said on this thread to other people haha

[Bullet]

He's gonna rape him and steal his sword....what else is he gonna do to him? Seriously man I think cell can beat war hulk haha.

And I'm basing it off What I've seen cell do. ^_^

By the way tskuyomi it's funny what you said on this thread to other people haha

Hulk has with stood star destroying attacks, with toe to toe with Gladiators who destroy stars with his bare hands or energy blast, was strong enough to crack Onslaught armor, fought Thor countless of times, and lots more powerful beings. Hulk won't go down to ssj3 Goku, who I think whould just be wasting his time hitting him because he won't be able to hurt him that much; every thing Goku throws at Hulk he'll heal from in seconds. And Cell can beaten to a plup, and then get tossed in the sun.

[azn_sephiroth]

By the way...can war hulk bleed? Cause ssj3goku once said...(I think it was ssj3goku haha)

"Anyone who bleeds can die.."

And don't give me some noobish answer like...

"War hulk can't bleed against goku.." or.

"War Hulk is un bleddable..."

Just curious :amuse

They should make a show where the strongest characters in each show fight...and yes add pokemon into it!

I'd just love to see goku fight hulk..

[Bullet]

By the way...can war hulk bleed? Cause ssj3goku once said...(I think it was ssj3goku haha)

"Anyone who bleeds can die.."

And don't give me some noobish answer like...

"War hulk can't bleed against goku.." or.

"War Hulk is un bleddable..."

Just curious :amuse

They should make a show where the strongest characters in each show fight...and yes add pokemon into it!

I'd just love to see goku fight hulk..

Yes Hulk could bleed if badly injured. But he heals very fast, so you whould have to keep pounding him.

[azn_sephiroth]

Yes Hulk could bleed if badly injured. But he heals very fast, so you whould have to keep pounding him.

Alright thats all I wanted to know.

[Green Lantern]

DBZ characters are horrendously over-rated. Give me one example of a DBZ character destroying more than a single planet. They've never done it and I don't think they can destroy more than one at a time. There are numerous Marvel and DC characters capable of destroying universes with a thought, so don't think too highly of DBZ guys.

Kid Buu was teleporting around a solar system and destroying planet after planet at an extremely fast rate while Goku was charging up his Genki Dama at the end of the Buu saga if I recall correctly

(Not saying that Goku can beat Hulk, but answering your point about DBZ characters destroying multiple planets)

And as for why Kid Buu beats Hulk, read the thread which was posted sometime back- Kid Buu can scream holes in the fabric of time and space :P

[Dark Shadow]

Uh huh, and what are you basing that off of? What is Cell going to do to him? Hulk's healing power is beyond Cell's, Maestro came back from being reduced beyond atoms. Cell needs a full cell (and his cells are quite big as I recall).

In terms of physical strength the DBZ guys aren't all that impressive and with War Hulks sword putting him in the celestial range of power he could probably stand up to any energy blasts the DBZ guys can cook up. Apocalypse seemed confident War Hulk could take on a Celestial being, Marvels Celestial beings make DBZ characters look like nothing.

DBZ characters are horrendously over-rated. Give me one example of a DBZ character destroying more than a single planet. They've never done it and I don't think they can destroy more than one at a time. There are numerous Marvel and DC characters capable of destroying universes with a thought, so don't think too highly of DBZ guys
Kid Buu. And Frieza. We've never seen Frieza, though we can assume he has from his ramblings in DBZ.

About the Cell thing....you all forgot that he has the ability to increase his strength after healing from mortal wounds. Added with his regenerative factors and he has a small chance. Of course if Hulk pounds him constantly and Cell regenerates and powers up, he has a good chance. And he powers up by alot, proving this fact in the Cell Games when he returned as an SSJ2

why SSJ2? Cell has most of the Saiyans abilities. Also, he's the only villian to have a yellow aura, just like the SSJ's. When he returned from the dead, yellow aura AND electricity, just like SSJ2's.

Him and Kid Buu are probably the only ones who could beat War Hulk...probably

And Kid Buu didn't rip holes, Evil Buu did that.

[Bullet]

Kid Buu was teleporting around a solar system and destroying planet after planet at an extremely fast rate while Goku was charging up his Genki Dama at the end of the Buu saga if I recall correctly

(Not saying that Goku can beat Hulk, but answering your point about DBZ characters destroying multiple planets)

And as for why Kid Buu beats Hulk, read the thread which was posted sometime back- Kid Buu can scream holes in the fabric of time and space :P

Buu can sceam a hole in the fabric of time but that doesn't mean hes physically more powerful.

[Dark Shadow]

Buu can sceam a hole in the fabric of time but that doesn't mean hes physically more powerful.
Oh come on dude....that stuff is powerful :P

And I read something in this thread about Oozaru control....having a tail does increase your strength, but nobody other than Vegeta can control an Oozaru state.

[Kamendex]

Kid Buu was teleporting around a solar system and destroying planet after planet at an extremely fast rate while Goku was charging up his Genki Dama at the end of the Buu saga if I recall correctly

(Not saying that Goku can beat Hulk, but answering your point about DBZ characters destroying multiple planets)

And as for why Kid Buu beats Hulk, read the thread which was posted sometime back- Kid Buu can scream holes in the fabric of time and space :P


Umm....no he cant....Kid Buu cannot scream holes in the "fabric of time and space....." However, Super Buu can.....but seeing as how Super Buu>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kid Buu and SSj Gotenks>>>>Kid Buu and SSj Gotenks couldnt do it.....Kid Buu cannot....

Dragonball characters are seriously overrated....

And to the ignorant person who said only AT can beat a Dragonball character.....please leave...and never debate again.

And Azn_Sephiroth why in the HELL would you include Gokuu in the category of "too strong to have a sane debate about" when Gokuu is not even CLOSSSSSSSE to being the strongest in his OWN anime?

[Priest_Mahado]

I voted Goku (Man it took so long to activate this new account)
But i Prefer Anime than American Animation

no offence if your g** with a guy that is green, with huge musclse, and is a complete idiot

[konflikti]

I voted Goku (Man it took so long to activate this new account)
But i Prefer Anime than American Animation

no offence if your g** with a guy that is green, with huge musclse, and is a complete idiot
Take out green and we are talking about Goku. War Hulk is less idiot than Goku is by the way.

One should also remember that when it comes to Battledome, it doesn't matter which character you prefer.

[tdultima]

cell can destroy the solar system

ssj3 goku > cell

Cell explains that he now has the power to gain strength from near
death experiences like a Saiyan; he may regenerate from a single cell
like Piccolo; and like Frieza, Cell may survive at any place. Cell now
plans to use his great power to destroy the entire solar system


http://www.pojo.com/dragonball/EpisodeSummaries/USdbz/USdbz175TheHorrorWontEnd.shtml

[azn_sephiroth]

Take out green and we are talking about Goku. War Hulk is less idiot than Goku is by the way.

One should also remember that when it comes to Battledome, it doesn't matter which character you prefer.

Well actually.....Goku doesn't have that huge of muscles unless he turns ultimate ssj. ( Or asended saiyan)

Second: Goku is NOT stupid. Anyone can tell...he may act stupid, but he isn't stupid. Yajirobee's stupid, goku isn't.

And yes I agree with you on the battledome part.

[Bullet]

cell can destroy the solar system

ssj3 goku > cell




http://www.pojo.com/dragonball/EpisodeSummaries/USdbz/USdbz175TheHorrorWontEnd.shtml

Cell can't destroy solar systems. Did he actually do that? Nope!:cool

[Tsukiyomi]

Kid Buu. And Frieza. We've never seen Frieza, though we can assume he has from his ramblings in DBZ.


Ok, first off read my post again, I said I doubt they can destroy more than one at a time, and none of them have EVER destroy multiple planets in a single blast, it was always one at a time. Regular Hulk has reached levels of anger where he can destroy things bigger than the earth.

About the Cell thing....you all forgot that he has the ability to increase his strength after healing from mortal wounds. Added with his regenerative factors and he has a small chance. Of course if Hulk pounds him constantly and Cell regenerates and powers up, he has a good chance. And he powers up by alot, proving this fact in the Cell Games when he returned as an SSJ2


Hulk's regenerative abilities put Kid Buu and Cell to shame, he's the only fictional character I've seen come back from being atomized

[tdultima]

ill upload proof from the manga

CELL CAN DESTROY THE SOLAR SYSTEM

http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/6754/cellsolar1nr.gif

[azn_sephiroth]

^ woah....haha

[tdultima]

if cell can do it

ssj3 goku or buu can easily do it as well

[konflikti]

Well did he destroy solar system with that ki? Because I can tell the same thing to you too and laugh on top of it.

[tdultima]

Well did he destroy solar system with that ki?

no because ssj2 gohan blocked it

and ssj3 goku > ssj2 gohan

thats the whole point

[Uchiha_Zero]

Goku wins as much as I hate admitting it.:notrust

[Tsukiyomi]

Uh huh, and how did Gohan block this without half the planet being blown away? My point still stands, not a single DBZ character or villain has destroyed more than one planet at a time, even Buu who was supposed to be the strongest. Why didn't he just take out solar systems instead of planets?

[tdultima]

i don't know its a manga and hulk is a comic book

i cant offer explainations for what happens

all i know is that cell said he can destroy the solar system

hell even early vegeta could destroy a planet with the galic gun

as for why villians dont dont simply destroy the entire solar system, its because if they did that there would be no story :P

[konflikti]

It's a tech. desinged for taking out planet. He can't do that by simply gathering his ki and sending it to the planets direction. I'm starting to think that Hulk has enough raw strenght to brawl a ki attack back to its source or atleast deflect it. Not like it did any permanent damage to him anyway.

[Tsukiyomi]

I'll restate what I said before about regeneration. No DBZ (or GT for that matter) character has ever come back from having all their cells destroyed.

An incarnation of the Hulk came back from having his body atomized, there weren't even atoms left of him, just his energy signature. THATS how insane his healing power is.

[azn_sephiroth]

Can hulk heal after he gets aids? From pink hulk from Mad T.v ^_^

[Bullet]

ill upload proof from the manga

CELL CAN DESTROY THE SOLAR SYSTEM

http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/6754/cellsolar1nr.gif

How do you know Cell wasn't bullfing? Because he was off by Gohan with a Planet destroying blast.

[Bullet]

It's a tech. desinged for taking out planet. He can't do that by simply gathering his ki and sending it to the planets direction. I'm starting to think that Hulk has enough raw strenght to brawl a ki attack back to its source or atleast deflect it. Not like it did any permanent damage to him anyway.

Hulk does, he walked right through Galdiators star destroying blast. And Healed in only a few seconds.

[Priest_Mahado]

Can hulk heal after he gets aids? From pink hulk from Mad T.v ^_^
LOL hahaha so true so true

lol double my real post is the second one

It's a tech. desinged for taking out planet. He can't do that by simply gathering his ki and sending it to the planets direction. I'm starting to think that Hulk has enough raw strenght to brawl a ki attack back to its source or atleast deflect it. Not like it did any permanent damage to him anyway.
man u wrong its not talk without an extra push from goku, gohan could of died. so if he is able to beat gohan in one of his strongest stage the solar system could of been destroyed (solar system = destory the nine planets and moons including the sun, that means gohan and goku can destoy the sun which they were only in ssj 2 so if goku gose ssj3 he can destory something bigger than a solar system which mean more stars)

is war hulk, hulk's ultamait form?
if yes
why don't u vs him with gokus ultamait form (if he bonded with the dragon balls he can just make the war hulk vanish lol) only if yes

[Bullet]

man u wrong its not talk without an extra push from goku, gohan could of died. so if he is able to beat gohan in one of his strongest stage the solar system could of been destroyed (solar system = destory the nine planets and moons including the sun, that means gohan and goku can destoy the sun which they were only in ssj 2 so if goku gose ssj3 he can destory something bigger than a solar system

Prove that he can destroy a solar system? Because Buu wasn't capable of even doing that.

[konflikti]

man u wrong its not talk without an extra push from goku, gohan could of died. so if he is able to beat gohan in one of his strongest stage the solar system could of been destroyed (solar system = destory the nine planets and moons including the sun, that means gohan and goku can destoy the sun which they were only in ssj 2 so if goku gose ssj3 he can destory something bigger than a solar system which mean more stars)

is war hulk, hulk's ultamait form?
if yes
why don't u vs him with gokus ultamait form (if he bonded with the dragon balls he can just make the war hulk vanish lol) only if yes

I was talking about Galic Gun. There is no record of Goku fighting after absorbing Dragon Balls. He might as well lost all his powers after that. (ain't that correct? I ain't DB GT specialist to be truthful)And see the name of the thread? Yeah, Goku from DBZ versus War Hulk. That's it.

And I do know what is solar system... *sigh*

[Dark Shadow]

Originally Posted by Dark Shadow
Kid Buu. And Frieza. We've never seen Frieza, though we can assume he has from his ramblings in DBZ.

Ok, first off read my post again, I said I doubt they can destroy more than one at a time, and none of them have EVER destroy multiple planets in a single blast, it was always one at a time. Regular Hulk has reached levels of anger where he can destroy things bigger than the earth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Shadow
About the Cell thing....you all forgot that he has the ability to increase his strength after healing from mortal wounds. Added with his regenerative factors and he has a small chance. Of course if Hulk pounds him constantly and Cell regenerates and powers up, he has a good chance. And he powers up by alot, proving this fact in the Cell Games when he returned as an SSJ2

Hulk's regenerative abilities put Kid Buu and Cell to shame, he's the only fictional character I've seen come back from being atomized

Oh my bad.

Well, pretty much, only Buu has destroyed planets in DBZ one at a time. Once during the Kid Buu saga and from what Supreme Kai said about Buu during the World Tournament

Vegeta never uses Galic Gun again after the Saiyajin Saga

War Hulk wins..

[Kamendex]

man u wrong its not talk without an extra push from goku, gohan could of died. so if he is able to beat gohan in one of his strongest stage the solar system could of been destroyed (solar system = destory the nine planets and moons including the sun, that means gohan and goku can destoy the sun which they were only in ssj 2 so if goku gose ssj3 he can destory something bigger than a solar system which mean more stars)

is war hulk, hulk's ultamait form?
if yes
why don't u vs him with gokus ultamait form (if he bonded with the dragon balls he can just make the war hulk vanish lol) only if yes

Umm....Gokuu never gave any extra push...he was only their spiritually for support...nothing else. Plus, Gohan was less than 50% of his power during that fight...and his final unleashing of his power that killed Cell was only at 50% (since he lost 50% from Cells blast...stupid Vegeta). All that power was Gohan's...Gokuu did not shoot a kamehameha with him :blink

[Priest_Mahado]

I was talking about Galic Gun. There is no record of Goku fighting after absorbing Dragon Balls. He might as well lost all his powers after that. (ain't that correct? I ain't DB GT specialist to be truthful)And see the name of the thread? Yeah, Goku from DBZ versus War Hulk. That's it.

And I do know what is solar system... *sigh*
well sorry about the mix up

Umm....Gokuu never gave any extra push...he was only their spiritually for support...nothing else. Plus, Gohan was less than 50% of his power during that fight...and his final unleashing of his power that killed Cell was only at 50% (since he lost 50% from Cells blast...stupid Vegeta). All that power was Gohan's...Gokuu did not shoot a kamehameha with him :blink
no i meant like he talked to his son and convinced him that he can do it (i didn't mean power boost)

[Kamendex]

no i meant like he talked to his son and convinced him that he can do it (i didn't mean power boost)

Except you were saying Cell could've beat Gohan...when that is not true. Gohan was PURPOSELY holding back because he did not want to damage the earth...but Gokuu told him to unleash the rest of the power he had left (which was about 50% of his full power).

[Othni]

First off, priest Mahado, quit double posting and triple posting. There is a such thing as 'Edit'

Ok, the thing with kid buu and not destroying all planets. He was searching. Goku was hiding and so far away that he couldn't sense him. But buu did not know that so he looked on every planet and if he found nothing of interest, he destroyed it. Also, he destroyed it with himself on it. At first it took him like...one second to regenerate from that blast, but then after that, it was immidiate.

[Ssj3_Goku]

i just want to say one thing. in the Majin buu saga where debora and babitii mesure gokus power..

debora says its possible to destroy a planet with 300 killies ( i think thats how u spell it) 3000 a human with that much power does notexisit ( goku a t 3000 killies) i mean so hell thats pretty strong just going to ssj1 form.. danm. ( also says this in the manga)

[Kamendex]

Yes....Gokuu can destroy a planet....how this makes him even remotely deadly towards War Hulk is beyond me....

[Ssj3_Goku]

300 is to destroy a planet 3000 just in super sayen 1 that nuts to me...

[konflikti]

Well that really doesn't indicate anything. It is not like 'killies' is some universal thing you can compare things with. Hulk takes hits from sun busters and is ready to brawl more. He gets reduced to skeleton and first thing he asks for is new pants after regenerating in time span of seconds.

[Othni]

That's just saying that he's more than a 'sun buster'. He's a universal buster with blast that are bigger than war hulk's body.

[Ssj3_Goku]

Well that really doesn't indicate anything. It is not like 'killies' is some universal thing you can compare things with. Hulk takes hits from sun busters and is ready to brawl more. He gets reduced to skeleton and first thing he asks for is new pants after regenerating in time span of seconds.


true i am just indicating that if they say onl 300 to destroy a planet and in ssj1 hes at 3000 ( i know killies but their is a big gap their and if they have the power to destroy a plent at 300 picture what they can do in 3000 just in ssj1... I mean reduced to a skeleton thats cool and all but the dbz goku has enough power to reduce him to no atoms or cells at all. i mean 300 to destroy a planet and in ssj1 3000 .. I am just saying their expressions of that kind of power in the anime/ manga it amazes me that they still have ( well goku) 2 forms of power left and that does not count the training he did after the buu saga.

[lekki]

I can't believe that it got to 308 posts personally:)

War Hulk can punch holes in reality but by the end of DBZ, Goku is so strong he can fight a being that can make holes in reality by yelling...

That is enough to show who wins this fight.

[Zouri]

Ok, I am tired of this. Unfortunately, everyone seems to think that SSJ3 Goku is the strongest fighter in existence, and that none can stand up to him. However, not only is SSJ3 Goku not the strongest fighter in his own series, he is not the strongest fighter period. I hope that this post proves it, as well as War Hulk's victory.

1) SSJ3 is not invincible. Yet, in this fourm that seems to be what I'm seeing. First off, I'm almost positive that no one in SSJ3 has EVER won a fight in the DBZ series. SSJ3 Goku tied with Fat Buu, the weakest of the Buu incarnations. SSJ3 Gotenks, who Goku states is stronger than him, lost to Evil Buu, who I feel is the third strongest form of Buu. Because the two of them split during the fight, I call it a loss. Later, SSJ3 Goku lost to Kid Buu, the second strongest Buu (who, though i could be wrong, could not shout holes in reality). As you can remember, everyone Buu absorbed had been taken from him, and even Vegeta stated that Buu had weakened drastically when he entered Kid Buu form. Meaning Super Buu, the one that fought Vageto (sp?) has to be the strongest form. SSJ3 Goku's fight is a loss in my book, because Vegeta had to sub in for him as he knew Goku was losing. He only did this so Goku could power a Spirit Bomb, which leads me to my next point...

2) The Spirit Bomb does not count as Goku's power. It is a technique taught to him by King Kai, and only gains power through people giving their energy. This technique, to my knowledge, also has not been able to kill any villain during the series. It failed to kill EARLY Vegeta, Freeza, and Buu. And because everyone thinks that it is stronger than a Kame-hame-ha, if it can't defeat EARLY VEGETA, then it can't defeat War Hulk. Also, the amount of time needed to conjure up a Spirit Bomb in the past has been ridiculously long. Against, Kid Buu, it took what must have been 10 minutes to get it to where it was, and that was only because of Hercule's assistance. Also, as I recall, the Spirit Bomb against Kid Buu was being pushed back, and he was only defeated after being knocked into it (I could be wrong on this, but if my memory serves correctly, this is the truth). Therefore, Sprit Bomb can;t be a factor in Goku's strength.

3) Though both Buu and Cell have regenerative abilities, both have failed to protect them. As we can see with Cell, the only reason he came back was because he had one cell left. Though he meant to blow up the world with his suicide attack, he was somehow kept alive. And now, for me to clear something up...

This strays away from my point for a bit, but how could Cell blow up a Solar System? I own the Cell games fight in Shonen Jump format, the entire battle, and I can not recall Cell ever being able to reach that kind of power. Tomorrow, I will personally look up the manga myself and see if he could. Sorry for not being able to believe proof from one picture, but it seems wierd how Cell's suicide blast could only destroy Earth, yet he can destroy a Solar System. Also, I can't see the pic.

Now, back to where I was, yes he could come back using one cell, but as Tsukiyomi put it, War Hulk revived from a single atom. Much less than a Cell. Also, if Gohan could destroy every cell in Cell's body, then it can't be seen as a good regenerative system. Next, Buu, who was also completely destroyed. Though never explained how powerful his regenerative system was, everyone can assume it was stronger than Cell's. However, this does not mean it can withstand attacks that destroy galaxies. Hulk, regular Hulk, can destroy galaxies if angry enough. All we've ever seen Buu do was destroy one planet at a time. (And don't tell me he did more than ONE in a single blast, though the Kais said it, it was never shown. And, that was a more powerful Buu than Kid Buu if I remember correctly.) Whenever Buu regenerated as I recall, there was almost always a large portion of his body left (ie. right side of his body, something large). This leads me to belive that Buu's ability to regenerate is not as great as people see it. Now, as we've seen before, comic book characters have died. War Hulk, however, did not die. Therefore, I put his abilities above Buu's.

4) This one is short. SSJ3 Goku is of course greater than SSJ2 Gohan. Why this was even brought up is beyond me. The real question is, is SSJ3 Goku stronger than Mystic Gohan, which most people would agree is NOT the case. There was a topic like that, but I'm not searching for it. Look it up to see that the major consensus would see Gohan as the victor.

And Lastly, this one is a personal vendetta of mine. (Something that SSJ3 Goku said. No offense, but I hear this too often in DBZ debates, and it annoys me.)

SSJ3 Goku, those numbers mean nothing. Any fan site will give you fake numbers to try and add more content, and those "killias" or whatever seem to be extremely off. As I recall, Raditz had a power level of 400+. Yet he was unable to destroy a planet. Yet, you say 300 of these "killias" can destroy a planet. This info you have seems to be suspect of some misleading levels. As I remember, when Goku fought Nappa his base power level was 5000+ or something to that effect. Vegeta could blow up a planet, and we all know that he was much stronger than Nappa. Therefore, we can conclude that to destroy a planet, one would need more than 300 whatevers.

Now, I know this post has been god-awfully long, and that I must look insane for getting this involved in something this stupid. However, I don't care. I'm just sharing my point in this debate, which is currently spinning out of control IMO. Not because of it's length, but because of info being passed around. Personally, I'm hoping that someone will take the time to read all of this and give me a nice rebuttal, but I doubt that will be the case.

Now, as I end my post, all I can say is I hope that people will at least take the time to read this. I am anxiously awaiting replies, hopefully with some counter-statements.

-Zouri

[lekki]

1.I don't recall anyone saying he's invincible but if they did, what they probably meant was compared to us, he's pretty much invincible
2.Spirit Bomb killed Buu. He's a martial artist, every bloody thing he does is learned.
3.Goku wanted the kids to defeat Fat Buu so earth won't rely on a dead guy.
4. SSJ3 Goku is not stronger than Mystic Gohan
5. SSJ3 Goku destroys the War Hulk.
.

[itachidattebayo]

An SSJ1 Goku can destroy earth, let alone an SSJ3 and if you absorb Goku's power, you will blow.......(Babidi Saga)

[lekki]

Yeah, but they're not allowed to destroy the earth in this fight.

[Othni]

He learns quick at that too. And even if he's not allowed to blow up earth, he's still alowed to blow up war hulk. And for zouri's big longass rebuttle (is that how you spell it?) Cell sayed "I've gathered enough 'ki' to not only blow up earth, but the whole solar system" He's talking about his kamehameha...I think

[Kamendex]

Umm SSj3_Goku is not making up the killies info....it is in the manga...

Also, why does that matter? Destroying a planet would do nothing short of piss off the Hulk....

And I still dont see why people are using SSj3 Gokuu vs Hulk.....INSTEAD of CHOU GOHAN. I mean War Hulk is light years ahead of Gohan and Gohan is light years ahead of Gokuu.....so why would someone not make a thread that says Chou Gohan vs War Hulk...even though Hulk would win...it would be a lot better fight.

[azn_sephiroth]

SSJ3 Goku, those numbers mean nothing. Any fan site will give you fake numbers to try and add more content, and those "killias" or whatever seem to be extremely off.

Uhh no....those numbers ARENT made up....geezus christ...

[Hatsune Miku]

SSJ3Goku. He's a Saiyan to the highest level. Ain't afraid to kick War Hulk's ass.

[Kamendex]

SSJ3Goku. He's a Saiyan to the highest level. Ain't afraid to kick War Hulk's ass.

Oh no....Gokuu is a big bad Super Saiya-jin....please read about War Hulk before making such an irrational comment....Gokuu would get torn to shreds.

[Zouri]

I guess I should clear something up: (using Lekki's post)

First off, I never said anyone actually said Goku was invincible, that's just the general tone I get from any conversation about DBZ, which annoys me.

Two, though I'm probably wrong, I thought that the Spirit Bomb was being pushed back by Buu. Though I'm only going by my memory of seing the anime, I recall that he was pushing it back until something happened, but I could be wrong.

Three, I did forget about that, so I'll give you that one.

Four, why I added the Mystic Gohan reference was because I think a better match up would be Mystic Gohan vs. War Hulk. Because since Goku couldn't be a weaker version of Buu without a Spirit Bomb (which I don't count as a part of his power), I don't really think of Goku as highly as Gohan.

Five, as for the Solar System thing, I'll also give that to you. (Though it still seems wierd as hell that Cell can.)

And for the numbers bit, I know that there are numbers for measuring power levels, it's just that those numbers IMO really don't mean anything. Especially once you get to Freeza. Once there, numbers mean little more than squat. And since those numbers can't be used to base anything, I don't really call them usefull in a debate.

[Kamendex]

The Genki Dama was pushed back by Buu because Gokuu did not have enough energy himself to push it....the Genki Dama itself had MORE than enough energy to kill Kid Buu.

[Zouri]

Oh, I see. Thanks for clearing that up for me Kamendex.

[Kamendex]

Yep yep no problem...

[Priest_Mahado]

I am amazed that this tread is still alive

[Ssj3_Goku]

numbers mean squat well i am just trying to prove a point at that part of the story he in ss 1 3000 killies where dabora said only 300 to destroy a planet i mean hell a soloar system or some shit can go with 3000.. its just the fact that it shows that Goku is a fucking power house and he still has ssj2 and 3 to go to..

[EvilMoogle]

numbers mean squat well i am just trying to prove a point at that part of the story he in ss 1 3000 killies where dabora said only 300 to destroy a planet i mean hell a soloar system or some shit can go with 3000.. its just the fact that it shows that Goku is a fucking power house and he still has ssj2 and 3 to go to..

I love numbers, gives me a chance to inject some math into a thread.

Give a few assumptions:
Killies have a linear progression (due to the jumps between "power ups" this seems logical).
"Destroy a planet" means "destroy an Earth-like planet" not "destroy the smallest planet" nor "destroy any planet regardless of size"

Then we know that the sun is 1252 times the Earth's size (volume), destruction based on size would take a killies rating of around 375,600.

However to me mass seems a better indicator of destructive force required. The sun's mass is about 333,000 times that of the Earth. This would bump up the Killies rating required to destroy the sun to around 99,900,000.

The real question is how many killes does a SSJ3 Goku have (which isn't stated in the comic, as I understand it. A better question might be how many Killies does he have before SSJ1 so we can get an understanding of the increase in power between normal and SSJ1 and apply this to SSJ2 and SSJ3).

Then for comparison we should look at the Hulk's villians and what they're able to do and assign Killies ratings to them as well, and we'll get a good numrical analysis. Sadly I've not read much of the Hulk (let alone War Hulk) so I'll leave this up to someone else to bring up.

[Othni]

^ Also what's hard about that is that goku was calm at that time. (I beleave) and he usually gets really pissed so that increases his killies thingies. And killies is different from powerlevel so we can't really find it on a site...math is fun, but sometimes really hard when you have almost nothing to work with. :)

[konflikti]

Well if Hulk is really pissed off, physics don't apply to him. I think that should solve the problem already. It seems that people don't realize that something that trumps the physics is definately going to bring Goku down.
...for the enemies, Hulk has fought Gladiator, who is a Superman level combatant, able to destroy sun with punch.

[GTOnizukadude]

SSJ3 Goku, please go away. You lose.
Hulk smash puny monkey.

[Hatsune Miku]

SSJ3 Goku, please go away. You lose.
Hulk smash puny monkey.

Nice one GTOnizukadude. Though I'm on Goku's side.

[Bullet]

Hulk wins this. SSJ3/4 Goku won't be able to stop Hulk at all. He'll basiclly tire himself out trying to fight Hulk (which by the way ssj3/4 Goku doesn't have the physical strength to hurt Hulk), Hulk takes planet/star destroying physical and energy attacks all the time. Hulk will heal from evry attack ssj3/4 Goku throws at him.

[tdultima]

Hulk has fought Gladiator, who is a Superman level combatant, able to destroy sun with punch.

when has gladiator ever destroyed a sun with one punch?

[tdultima]

Hulk takes planet/star destroying physical and energy attacks all the time.

such as? examples?

Hulk will heal from evry attack ssj3/4 Goku throws at him.

hulk can't fly

goku can shoot the entire planet towards the sun

any proof hulk can survive in the sun? infinite regeneration forever in the sun? will he jump off the sun? :laugh

[Priest_Mahado]

such as? examples?



hulk can't fly

goku can shoot the entire planet towards the sun

any proof hulk can survive in the sun? infinite regeneration forever in the sun? will he jump off the sun? :laugh
lol man and anyway even if u other guys say hulk wins, goku wins in the polls lol

[braindx]

lol man and anyway even if u other guys say hulk wins, goku wins in the polls lol

Well, that's cause people don't read the thread or they don't know Hulk's abilities otherwise it's quite obvious why Hulk would win.

hulk can't fly

goku can shoot the entire planet towards the sun

any proof hulk can survive in the sun? infinite regeneration forever in the sun? will he jump off the sun?

Sigh.

1a. Hulk doesn't need to fly. He's beat people who have greater speeds than Goku.
1b. Also, he can just clap multiple times and the air shockwave from his hands will destroy Goku. Please keep in mind the air compression waves from an atomic bomb is what actually destroys most of the stuff in the blast radius.

2a. Goku wouldn't destroy a planet.
2b. Even if Goku acted to destroy earth (in any sort of way), Hulk could jump into space and survive
2c. Goku cannot survive in space

3a. Hulk would not die in the sun as he would be so angry that someone put him there in the first place that his regeneration rate wouldn't let him get vaporized.
3b. Also, Hulk would get so angry (And therefore strong) that he would get enough power in his legs to jump off of the sun. We already discussed this in the thread before so if you would mind reading it before you post any more nonsense it would be appreciated.

4. The only category where Goku is better than Hulk is speed, and the Hulk has beat people who are faster than Goku. Therefore, the Hulk wins.

5. This is not debatable as it is all facts.

[Green Lantern]

Firstly I need to make a big point-
This match is WAR HULK

Not Maestro Hulk!!

War Hulk does not have Silver Surfers board,

and Maestro Hulk, Not War Hulk, was the one who came back from atoms
Maestro Hulk is the ultimate form of Hulk because he has absorbed many years worth of radiation, and because he has the mind of Bruce Banner

So when you say that Hulk has been vaporised into atoms, you are incorrect- War Hulk was not vaporised into atoms, Maestro was, and it is War Hulk who is in this match

Also to the Goku people saying that Goku could blow up the planet etc, Note the beginning of the match in which I stated: No planetary destruction

Pay attention to details and get your facts straight!

[braindx]

Whoops, hehe. I'll edit before people respond.

[Ssj3_Goku]

I still stand at what i said early about the killies and all.. Thats alot of danm power and still has 2 forms left. so i still says ssj3 goku wins.

[Bullet]

I still stand at what i said early about the killies and all.. Thats alot of danm power and still has 2 forms left. so i still says ssj3 goku wins.

SSJ3/4 Goku hasn't the slightest chance at winning this fight. Goku even at his strongest incarnation isn't enough to even stagger War Hulk. One hit from the Hulk and the fight is over.

Here's some of the Hulk feats:

The Hulk squeezing adamantium.

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/744/blastaar7os7ot.jpg

We see here Gladiator destroying planets/stars with his barehands and his Heat Vision (that's hotter than stars). Hulk is just walking threw his Heat Vision and in seconds heals from the attack.

http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/2195/planetsmash16bb.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/7397/planetsmash26fq.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/5874/theincrediblehulkannual1997171.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/5102/theincrediblehulkannual1997189.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/1874/theincrediblehulkannual1997192.jpg

Here's Hulk destroying a asteriod twice the size of Earth.

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/5352/asteroid15sc0qy.jpg

http://img365.imageshack.us/img365/5108/featsasteroid1a7xe9tn.jpg

Hulk caring an Island while swimming in the water.

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/2439/island2a8xc6bg.jpg

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/4467/featsisland1b6wa6yo.jpg

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/1002/featsisland1c8qw1fg.jpg

Hulk taking a planet destroying blast from Vector who does it with ease. And then he fights him again with even more force that burn his flesh off of his body, which Hulk heals from in just a matter of seconds.

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/2518/vector20pk0al.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/8426/vector38og1jt.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/3391/vector3a0dn4rg.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/7098/healing2ky.jpg

Hulk wins this with no problem at all. Those were just normal Hulk feats, not even Savage or War Hulk who ssj3/4 Goku is fighting against. He stands little chance of winning against Hulk.:nono

[Ssj3_Goku]

and vegeta destroyed a planet and a moon with his danm finger. and that was in the sayein saga...

the regeneration is np he was reduced to a skelaton and back again.. Cell had 1 danm cell left and he came back.. Buu came back from just smoke. I mean a powerful enough blast from goku and hulk wont regenerate back IMO.

but everyone has their opionon .. plus goku has speed on his side and the instant transmission.. to each his own i guess.

[tdultima]

and vegeta destroyed a planet and a moon with his danm finger. and that was in the sayein saga...

exactly nothing posted here has even surpassed early vegeta

perfect cell after regeneration evolved to the point where he could destroy the solar system

ssj3 goku is not the strongest in the manga but he is stronger than cell thats for sure

[azn_sephiroth]

SSJ3/4 Goku hasn't the slightest chance at winning this fight. Goku even at his strongest incarnation isn't enough to even stagger War Hulk. One hit from the Hulk and the fight is over.

Here's some of the Hulk feats:

The Hulk squeezing adamantium.

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/744/blastaar7os7ot.jpg

We see here Gladiator destroying planets/stars with his barehands and his Heat Vision (that's hotter than stars). Hulk is just walking threw his Heat Vision and in seconds heals from the attack.

http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/2195/planetsmash16bb.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/7397/planetsmash26fq.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/5874/theincrediblehulkannual1997171.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/5102/theincrediblehulkannual1997189.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/1874/theincrediblehulkannual1997192.jpg

Here's Hulk destroying a asteriod twice the size of Earth.

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/5352/asteroid15sc0qy.jpg

http://img365.imageshack.us/img365/5108/featsasteroid1a7xe9tn.jpg

Hulk caring an Island while swimming in the water.

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/2439/island2a8xc6bg.jpg

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/4467/featsisland1b6wa6yo.jpg

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/1002/featsisland1c8qw1fg.jpg

Hulk taking a planet destroying blast from Vector who does it with ease. And then he fights him again with even more force that burn his flesh off of his body, which Hulk heals from in just a matter of seconds.

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/2518/vector20pk0al.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/8426/vector38og1jt.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/3391/vector3a0dn4rg.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/7098/healing2ky.jpg

Hulk wins this with no problem at all. Those were just normal Hulk feats, not even Savage or War Hulk who ssj3/4 Goku is fighting against. He stands little chance of winning against Hulk.:nono

No body cares.....

And i agree with tdultima and ssj3 goku.

[tdultima]

I'll restate what I said before about regeneration. No DBZ (or GT for that matter) character has ever come back from having all their cells destroyed.

An incarnation of the Hulk came back from having his body atomized, there weren't even atoms left of him, just his energy signature. THATS how insane his healing power is.

first of all the fact that the MAESTRO (the strongest version of the hulk?) can be disintergrated by the gamma bomb proves that the hulk can in fact be defeated

http://www.gammabase.com/hulkdatabase/futureimperfect2-death.gif

second maestro didnt regenerate himself, he needed YEARS of radiation from the hulk to recover in a weakened state

yes the hulk has great regeneration but if goku shoots him into the sun thats the end of him


Incredible Hulk v2 #460 - The Maestro came back to life ten years after being blown up by the Gamma Bomb.


In this "Hell" Bruce Banner spoke to the Maestro. The Maestro told him that no matter how long they die, given enough time they will always come back. He explained that the reason Bruce could always find the gamma bomb site is because Maestro's spirit was calling him there and his remains soak up gamma rays from his body, slowing reforming itself.

At the end of the issue, the Maestro's body was seen rising from the ground after finally healing himself from death.


http://www.gammabase.com/index.php?hulkdatabase/maestro.php

[Tsukiyomi]

Wow, someone posted hulk scans...and it wasn't me?

first of all the fact that the MAESTRO (the strongest version of the hulk?) can be disintergrated by the gamma bomb proves that the hulk can in fact be defeated



Are you attempting to lecture me on the Hulk? First off, the Maestro is not the strongest Hulk in terms of durability and strength, that would be the mindless Hulk. The Guilt Hulk is most definetly above him, without using his genius brain I doubt Maestro could put a dent in the Guilt Hulk. There is also the Devil Hulk who IMHO has the most potential for power.

There is a reason that Marvel comics themselves refer to the Hulk as "the most powerful creature to ever walk the face of the earth", his potential power is INFINITE. The Beyonder himself once acknowledged there was no limit to the Hulk.

Secondly, the Gamma bomb tore him apart because it used Gamma radiation as a weapon, the source of the Hulk's existence, its the one thing you could say he is vulnerable to in extreme amounts. And like you were so kind to point out, he came back.

second maestro didnt regenerate himself, he needed YEARS of radiation from the hulk to recover in a weakened state

yes the hulk has great regeneration but if goku shoots him into the sun thats the end of him

The point is, he STILL came back from being reduced BEYOND ATOMS. Cell and Buu need a full cell atleast in order to come back, Maestro did it from being reduced beyond the atomic level.

Im tired of people using that stupid sun example, its been tried. Numerous people have tried taking the Hulk out into space, it never ends well for them.

As for the Sun destroying him, I'm not sure its the right frequency of radiation to exploit the Hulks weakness, and his healing factor could keep up with that with enough anger.

Incredible Hulk v2 #460 - The Maestro came back to life ten years after being blown up by the Gamma Bomb.


In this "Hell" Bruce Banner spoke to the Maestro. The Maestro told him that no matter how long they die, given enough time they will always come back. He explained that the reason Bruce could always find the gamma bomb site is because Maestro's spirit was calling him there and his remains soak up gamma rays from his body, slowing reforming itself.

At the end of the issue, the Maestro's body was seen rising from the ground after finally healing himself from death.


http://www.gammabase.com/index.php?hulkdatabase/maestro.php

Ahhh, gamma base, not a bad source of info. Thanks for pointing out that they always come back, in actuality I wouldn't say they "die", they just take longer to regnerate. This essentially proves that nothing Goku can ever do will KILL the Hulk, but the Hulk can kill Goku.

[tdultima]

hulk can regenerate after MANY YEARS if he can get radiation

im saying goku can find a way to disintegrate him and win the battle

but if winning means hulk outlives everyone i guess he wins

although goku can wish for eternal life with the dragonballs:P

[Tsukiyomi]

hulk can regenerate after MANY YEARS if he can get radiation

im saying goku can find a way to disintegrate him and win the battle

but if winning means hulk outlives everyone i guess he wins

although goku can wish for eternal life with the dragonballs:P

Thats Maestro healing from atomization. Like I said, atleast 3 incarnations of the Hulk are beyond him and would be able to regenerate faster, the Mindless Hulk (if anything could physically damage him) would probably recover from atomization as fast as the normal Hulk recovers from normal physical injuries.

Find a way to disintegrate him? How? The only way its ever been done is with a the gamma bomb, a weapon in absolute perfect sync with his powers (since it created them), the Hulk's been hit with nuclear weapons before and been perfectly fine (healing in seconds after only having parts of his body injured). Unless Goku has some kind of gamma based attacks I doubt he could disintegrate the Hulk (even if he did, there is always a chance the Hulks body would just absorb it as it does with most forms of radiation).

War Hulk (the one in question) is the savage Hulk augmented to the cosmic level of power by apocalypse, we have yet to see War Hulk hurt or even slowed down.

[tdultima]

if vector can push off a lot of hulks flesh why can't goku disintegrate him?

or goku can just shoot the entire planet into the sun and hulk can spend his eternity there

[Tsukiyomi]

if vector can push off a lot of hulks flesh why can't goku disintegrate him?

or goku can just shoot the entire planet into the sun and hulk can spend his eternity there

Vectors power is the ability to repel matter, essentially to cause an object to be torn apart under its own force. Its debatable that NOTHING would be beyond his ability to repel since it most likely occurs on the molecular level.

That couldn't be anymore different than a blast of energy trying to damage something. In that case durability is a factor on top of regeneration.

Also, when has a DBZ hero ever destroyed a planet? Goku would never do that to win a fight.

[korican04]

No body cares.....

And i agree with tdultima and ssj3 goku.
THat's a little rude, seeing as someone asked specifically for examples of when gladiator destroyed a planet and/or suns or hulk showing planet destroying capabilities..... but I guess no one cares about that person's (tdultima's) request then..

[tdultima]

the gamma bomb is an energy blast isnt it? otherwise wouldnt the gamma radiation make him even stronger?

you just have to hit hulk with something powerful enough to disintegrate him and goku can take out planets

and look forge's gun can kill the hulk

http://www.gammabase.com/index.php?weaponry/offensive.php

[korican04]

the gamma bomb is an energy blast isnt it? otherwise wouldnt the gamma radiation make him even stronger?

you just have to hit hulk with something powerful enough to disintegrate him and goku can take out planets

and look forge's gun can kill the hulk

http://www.gammabase.com/index.php?weaponry/offensive.php
The thing with the gamma radiation is that it causes a back lash of the same type of energy that created him, that's why it makes him either stronger or is able to harm him greatly, I believe this was explained in the maestro story.
Unless goku can produce the same type of gamma then he's assed out with regular "energy" blasts that the hulk will heal from, a lot of things can hurt the hulk but that's what the healing factor takes care of.
I'm not saying hulk would decimate goku but goku isn't or has access naturally to gamma radiation blast of some sort.

[Tsukiyomi]

the gamma bomb is an energy blast isnt it? otherwise wouldnt the gamma radiation make him even stronger?

you just have to hit hulk with something powerful enough to disintegrate him and goku can take out planets

and look forge's gun can kill the hulk

http://www.gammabase.com/index.php?weaponry/offensive.php

Gamma radiation is a bit of a wild card, its the most lethal form of radiation (I believe), but in the marvel universe 1 in 10,000 people can survive exposure (like Bruce Banner).

Since the source of the Hulk's power is Gamma radiation (its also the type his body naturally produces), it can potentially make him immensly stronger or counter the gamma radiation in his own body, thus allowing for greater damage than is normally possible.

So you see, its not just any energy, its the specific kind capable of hurting him most, but even that can't eliminate him totally.

[korican04]

^ you and i said with the same explantion essentially :thumbs

[Tsukiyomi]

^ you and i said with the same explantion essentially :thumbs

Time delay of having 7 windows open caused us to overlap, nice to see someone else talking lucid Hulk info.

[korican04]

^ no worries, i'm just glad my memory of comics that I read a while back is still there. Good to have someone confirm.

[Gooba]

I was going to post a parallel to resonance, but I saw you viewing this thread and figured you would do a better job. :thumbs

[tdultima]

if gladiator's eyebeams(not gamma) can cut through the hulk...

can't a large enough eyebeam just disintegrate him? like goku's beams?

and the sun thing...goku can wish back the planet

what is hulk going to do in the sun?

[korican04]

If goku blows up the planet, he dies, cause he can't survive in space, therefore he's assed out too.
War Hulk, the one we are talking about probably won't be scratched so easily. He is celestially enchanced. I really don't think the beam would disintegrate war hulk, but that's my opinion.
I think goku has the advantage as he has a lot of other abilities, but going near the hulk with a million punches like he always does in fights will get him killed yet again.
The point of these fights also is to have the people mentioned fight it out, this fight wasn't goku and the dragon balls vs normal hulk. This was War Hulk alone against SS3 Goku alone. Otherwise what's the point of fight.

[Tsukiyomi]

if gladiator's eyebeams(not gamma) can cut through the hulk...

can't a large enough eyebeam just disintegrate him? like goku's beams?

and the sun thing...goku can wish back the planet

what is hulk going to do in the sun?

Gladiator fought the regular hulk and barely managed to damage him in the scope of things, keep in mind this is a beam that has destroyed planets. Gladiator with all his powers couldn't beat the normal savage hulk, in fact he only survived because a little boy begged the Hulk not to kill Gladiator. Now we're talking about War Hulk who is far above that, like I said we never saw him scratched or even slowed down.

The fact remains Goku will never harm an innocent person to win a fight, and that includes all the living animals on earth.

As for what he's going to do in the sun, knowing marvel he would eventually become powerful enough to find a way out (either through anger or absorbtion of radiation).

[tdultima]

all im really asking is if hulk can survive total disintegration

because if cell can destroy the solar system then goku can probably muster up a beam to disintegrate hulk

and if it takes years for the hulk to regenerate from it ill count that as a win for goku...the battle at least

and i think goku can survive in space long enough to teleport to another planet

[Tsukiyomi]

all im really asking is if hulk can survive total disintegration

because if cell can destroy the solar system then goku can probably muster up a beam to disintegrate hulk

and if it takes years for the hulk to regenerate from it ill count that as a win for goku...the battle at least

and i think goku can survive in space long enough to teleport to another planet

Has Goku ever atomized anything? Maestro was atomized, Goku has destroyed all the cells in enemies, but never with his own power, he always needed a spirit bomb to disintegrate someone so don't assume he can disintegrate someone as durable as the Hulk, let alone War Hulk.

As for surviving, we don't know, War Hulk was never injured, so we never got to see his healing factor in action, but you can bet your ass if his strength and durability were augmented that much that his healing factor was also, so he probably could. I mean come on, his powers were augmented to the celestial level.

Imagine Hulks normally insane healing factor + celestial power. Goku would exhaust himself before he could kill Hulk.

[korican04]

I'll let tsukyomi handle the disintegration question.
But for the teleportation, goku couldn't teleport out of the planet when buu was about the blow it up, cause he was rushing and felt pressure (the kai came and saved him) and goku was still on earth with air and an atmosphere, so I doubt he could do it in the coldness of space, with no air, in a vaccumm, after the blast of an exploding earth.

[Bullet]

if gladiator's eyebeams(not gamma) can cut through the hulk...

can't a large enough eyebeam just disintegrate him? like goku's beams?

and the sun thing...goku can wish back the planet

what is hulk going to do in the sun?

No. Gladiators Blast is hotter than stars (sun), none of the DBZ/GT characters come blast come close to that much power.

[Dark Shadow]

PLus Goku can't live in Space. Only Freeza and Cell can.

[tdultima]

No. Gladiators Blast is hotter than stars (sun), none of the DBZ/GT characters come blast come close to that much power.


since the eye beam can clearly injure hulk...and its as hot as a star...how will hulk survive in the sun?

[Gooba]

as hot as a starhotter than stars...http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y197/Goobidy/null.gif

[lekki]

I specifically remember the Hulk being able to take Gladiators eye beams.
In fact, the last fight between them had the Hulk ending the fight by smashing the Gladiator into a nuclear reactor. I'm sure someone remembers this fight, Gladiator looked so pathetic.

Problem is Hulk varies so much but one thing I can assure you, that crap wouldn't happen with Warhulk, but Goku stilll wins :)

[Kamendex]

and vegeta destroyed a planet and a moon with his danm finger. and that was in the sayein saga...

the regeneration is np he was reduced to a skelaton and back again.. Cell had 1 danm cell left and he came back.. Buu came back from just smoke. I mean a powerful enough blast from goku and hulk wont regenerate back IMO.

but everyone has their opionon .. plus goku has speed on his side and the instant transmission.. to each his own i guess.

No he didnt....that was filler...Saiya-jin saga Vegeta is nowhere near powerful enough to destroy a planet with his finger.....

And stop with the killi crap...you cant compare that to Hulk....Gokuu can destroy a planet easily...so wat? Hulk can regenerate from it easily....

[Shinigami No1]

I dont think regeneration should count i think thats weak...
If they both had unlimited energy so that war hulk could regenerate forever, if Goku had the power to vapourise him he would also be able to do that forever. Thus it ends as stalemate but clearly war hulk has lost...
Hears my arguments for this massive thread lol...

Goku is a skilled warrior and martial artist with speed far surpassing basically anyone anywhere in any anime or american comic (poss excl. the flash but thats a discussion for a different battledome). He is also the strongest in his anime where to even be considered a threat you have to basically be able to blow up a planet with a finger and regenerate in some way or another (for the DBZ crew it was the dragonballs...). Goku ALWAYS gets stronger during his fights ALWAYS. An if its not due to him gettin beat down its because something or someone important to him is in danger.

The war hulk is not a character i know much about but going by the hulk an the little i do know i would say war hulk is a creature using raw power with speed incomparable to Videl let alone Goku lol. I hear rumours that he can regenerate from mere molecules but how long does that take? an also im sure that if the molecule of your enemy was floating about goku would have the brains to zap it one more time. Also i heard in this discussion about war hulk being comparable to celestial beings with his sword an the CB are greater than Goku. What a load of trash its all relative. I think all marvel/DC characters or watever fight their respective gods/CBs at one point jus when there own storyline runs out an the writer needs something to do. I pretty sure spiderman faced a CB at one point and one but does anyone here think that spiderman could beat goku!?!

War hulk would not be able to touch Goku an im not even talking about from a power perspective im talking about speed, if you cant catch it you cant hit it and im sure that Goku would figure out a way to put war hulk down or wear him out long enough jus to pile drive him with energy. And if war hulk ever threatened the earth or gokus family it would jus increase gokus power, i dont know of any attributes like that for War Hulk as far as im concerned hes jus big strong and angry lol.

Anyway as you can see i prefer DBZ/GT, i always found those muscle fights of the hulk boring and slow but hey if all else fails we can jus look at the results of the poll cant we...

[Gooba]

You might want to read the rest of the thread. Goku is way way slower than Silver Surfer and the Flash, yet the Hulk was able to catch SS's surfboard.

[Scared Link]

Goku will obviously win this fight.

[Shinigami No1]

hmm... i never think of the silver surfer as fast in a conventional sort of way. Yeah he travels the galaxy an all that but i mean speed as in combat situations...
Also im sure the board was caught in a really gay way in one of those stories where the surfer doesnt use his powers is neglectful an the hulk pops up an catches him... i very much doubt there was any chase involved but if im wrong then cool but hes still not gonna beat goku on reactions cos than your telling me that war hulk could keep up with SSJ3 speed which is faster than when goku an cell fought on the tournament an they were buzzing about.
(btw i think thats the best animated DBZ fight as they were really fast but they didnt do the gay *flurry of limbs* drawing which made it look even faster!!)

[EvilMoogle]

There are basically three major points to consider in this fight, and they add up to a Hulk win to me (the debate should focus around the second point for those that disagree).

1. If the Hulk manages to get his hands on Goku, Goku will die. I don't generally consider this a point open to argument, Goku has shown time and again that he can be killed, and generally by amounts of force that seem to be much less than he can deal out. If anything, the Hulk is the opposite, he can deal out great amounts of force, but he can take far greater hits without even getting hurt.

As it is, however, Goku is much faster, and as long as he stays on the defensive he can evade Hulk. I'll get back to this later, however the next thing we must consider is Goku's side of the offensive equation.

2. Can Goku hurt the Hulk? As I've said, I don't think he can. But this is the major area of debate on this fight. Goku's two biggest attacks both require signifigant "charge time" which I don't think Hulk's going to let him get. And I think Hulk would shrug off lesser energy blasts without really noticing them. I suppose he could do the spirit-bomb and teleport trick, but that will put him very close to the Hulk again, which means he loses outright if he doesn't kill the Hulk instantly.

This brings us to the last area of concern if we have a Goku that's to fast for the Hulk to hit, but can't hurt the Hulk with any of his attacks.

3. What happens in the long term fight? As long as the Hulk can stay mad, he can keep going at 100% (Actually his strength increases as the fight goes on, generally). Last I heard Goku can only stay in his SSJ3 form for a few minutes (37 episodes), that means the ball is in his court for offense.

If he tries to run away and play cat-and-mouse games, he'll run out of endurance and lose. If he gets too close to the Hulk, he'll get torn into several little fleshy bits. This gives him a narrow window to fight with.

Like I said, point 2 is the one that is really open to debate, however from what I've seen, I don't think Goku can win this one in just a few minutes. In a one-on-one fight he'd have no friends to back him up (or wish him back from the dead when he screws up), and frankly Goku's track record for first encounters is pretty poor.

[kapsi]

You might want to read the rest of the thread. Goku is way way slower than Silver Surfer and the Flash, yet the Hulk was able to catch SS's surfboard.
So comic makers are not reading what they wrote, what else is new.

[Pinkaugust]

Gooba, do you actually believe that the hulk can get indefinately mad? I think that there is a limit to the Hulks anger, even if it hasn't been discovered yet. Goku can destroy a planet, it doesn't matter how much he can lift, and he can destroy opponents far stronger than the Hulk, with the help from the Genki-dama. Can Hulk survive in space? Does Hulk melt in lava? Can Hulk deflect a Genki-dama or Kamehameha? Does Hulk weight more than 40 tons? Can Hulk destroy the Universe With one blow?
What did hulk lift that weighted 150 billion tons?
I think Hulk can't fight against this enemy, and therefore will lose, even if Goku went close and fought, cuz Hulk cannot hit him, and even if so, Gokus forehead can take bulletfire and not break, same with the rest of the body, and he can deflect hulks attack before the strike fell..

[Pinkaugust]

You might want to read the rest of the thread. Goku is way way slower than Silver Surfer and the Flash, yet the Hulk was able to catch SS's surfboard.
Is way faster than the speed of light (goku SSJ3) WAY WAY Slower than the speed of light? (silver surfer and the Flash)

[korican04]

Is way faster than the speed of light (goku SSJ3) WAY WAY Slower than the speed of light? (silver surfer and the Flash)
what?
Flash and SS are faster than the speed of light, we have even put scans up that show this on the boards.
When has goku shown to go around the world 7 times in 1 sec? if he was that fast then why teleport when on earth that would be slower cause he has to find the person he is teleporting to, that's why he Instant Transmisions cause he isn't that fast. He has to think of the person he is teleporting to, that right there is slower than the speed of light.
Speed of light >SS3 Goku in travel, that's why Goku uses his IT.

Also the rest of your questions, have been answered if you have read the rest of the thread.

[Tsukiyomi]

I dont think regeneration should count i think thats weak...
If they both had unlimited energy so that war hulk could regenerate forever, if Goku had the power to vapourise him he would also be able to do that forever. Thus it ends as stalemate but clearly war hulk has lost...
Hears my arguments for this massive thread lol...

Stalemate? Goku doesn't have unlimited energy, we've seen him tire many times to the point of not being able to stand up, and it didn't take very long. Hulk has limitless endurance. As for regeneration not counting, thats a stupid argument, it can make all the difference in a fight so of course it counts.

Goku is a skilled warrior and martial artist with speed far surpassing basically anyone anywhere in any anime or american comic (poss excl. the flash but thats a discussion for a different battledome). He is also the strongest in his anime where to even be considered a threat you have to basically be able to blow up a planet with a finger and regenerate in some way or another (for the DBZ crew it was the dragonballs...). Goku ALWAYS gets stronger during his fights ALWAYS. An if its not due to him gettin beat down its because something or someone important to him is in danger.

Ha, dude I've got news for you, there are a lot of people in American comics with speed surpassing Goku. He's not really that powerful compared to a lot of beings in american comics.

Secondly we've never seen him destroy a planet (Vegeta doing it with a finger was filler I believe). Now as for Goku getting stronger during a fight, big deal, its very limited from what I've seen, the Hulk gets stronger at a much faster rate.

The war hulk is not a character i know much about but going by the hulk an the little i do know i would say war hulk is a creature using raw power with speed incomparable to Videl let alone Goku lol. I hear rumours that he can regenerate from mere molecules but how long does that take? an also im sure that if the molecule of your enemy was floating about goku would have the brains to zap it one more time. Also i heard in this discussion about war hulk being comparable to celestial beings with his sword an the CB are greater than Goku. What a load of trash its all relative. I think all marvel/DC characters or watever fight their respective gods/CBs at one point jus when there own storyline runs out an the writer needs something to do. I pretty sure spiderman faced a CB at one point and one but does anyone here think that spiderman could beat goku!?!

You just admitted you know nothing about War Hulk. Hulk can regenerate at insane speeds, so don't underestimate that. As for running out of storyline, are you actually comparing the story of the Hulk to DBZ? Hulk is far superior in the storyline department.

DBZ = super powerful being appears, heros train, big drawn out fight with many power ups, heros win, lather rinse repeat.

Hulk is a psychological story of a man searching for peace within himself, a man just trying to live his life with a raging beast within him always trying to get out.

And yes, War Hulk is on the celestial level, regardless of what you think about it, you can't deny that just because you don't like it. Suppose I think the saiyan ability to become stronger from recovery is trash, can I just ignore that then?

War hulk would not be able to touch Goku an im not even talking about from a power perspective im talking about speed, if you cant catch it you cant hit it and im sure that Goku would figure out a way to put war hulk down or wear him out long enough jus to pile drive him with energy. And if war hulk ever threatened the earth or gokus family it would jus increase gokus power, i dont know of any attributes like that for War Hulk as far as im concerned hes jus big strong and angry lol.

Dude, Hulk can perceive speedsters, he can see things moving at super speeds like the silver surfer, his mind can follow them easily and in some cases he can keep up with them (like when he pulled the surfer off his board).

Goku would only succeed in pissing the Hulk off, thus making him stronger and stronger. As for wearing Hulk down, never going to happen, as long as he is mad he never tires. He'll just keep getting stronger, more durable and more able to regenerate as Goku tries to "wear him down".

And you just admitted again you know nothing about War Hulk. We've seen people (Juggernaut) who in terms of physical power are FAR beyond Goku fail to even scratch him.

Anyway as you can see i prefer DBZ/GT, i always found those muscle fights of the hulk boring and slow but hey if all else fails we can jus look at the results of the poll cant we...

ROFL, how many fights have you seen? I'm willing to bet NONE. If all his fights were just "slow muscle fights" it wouldn't have been as popular as it has been for decades. Lets see if DBZ is still popular in 40 years.

DBZ fights are just power ups and stupid displays of power.

Gooba, do you actually believe that the hulk can get indefinately mad? I think that there is a limit to the Hulks anger, even if it hasn't been discovered yet. Goku can destroy a planet, it doesn't matter how much he can lift, and he can destroy opponents far stronger than the Hulk, with the help from the Genki-dama. Can Hulk survive in space? Does Hulk melt in lava? Can Hulk deflect a Genki-dama or Kamehameha? Does Hulk weight more than 40 tons? Can Hulk destroy the Universe With one blow?
What did hulk lift that weighted 150 billion tons?
I think Hulk can't fight against this enemy, and therefore will lose, even if Goku went close and fought, cuz Hulk cannot hit him, and even if so, Gokus forehead can take bulletfire and not break, same with the rest of the body, and he can deflect hulks attack before the strike fell..

When will people read what I post, there is NO LIMIT to the Hulk's anger, this has been acknowledged by many people in the marvel universe including the beyonder who was powerful enough to occupy a universe alone and possessed near omniscience. He acknowleged the infinite potential of the Hulk's power.

As for Genki Dama, Hulk is not going to do what DBZ villains do and sit there going "oh shit, he's charging an attack, I better stand here and twitch my face". He'll throw buildings, cars and rocks if he can't reach Goku, and also the Genki Dama is slow, I don't care what anyone says, from what we've seen its a slow fucking attack. Hulk would just move out of the way.

Is way faster than the speed of light (goku SSJ3) WAY WAY Slower than the speed of light? (silver surfer and the Flash)

Well this proves you have no idea what you're talking about. Goku has never shown ANYTHING to indicate he's anywhere near the speed of light without his teleporation.

Light takes 8 minutes to get from the sun to the earth, Silver Surfer can cross galaxies in an instant, sounds pretty fucking far beyond the speed of light to me.

The Flash can go so fast he goes backwards through time and phases into other dimensions, sounds pretty far beyond the speed of light to me.

[kapsi]

Genki dama is not slow in manga, anime made it ridiculously slow.

[Gooba]

Gooba, do you actually believe that the hulk can get indefinately mad?Yes, there is no reason not to, other than ignoring the comics.

Can Hulk survive in space?Yes

Does Hulk melt in lava?No

Can Hulk deflect a Genki-dama or Kamehameha?If by deflect, you mean take it in the face and not care, then yes.

Does Hulk weight more than 40 tons?No, why does it matter? Does Goku?

Can Hulk destroy the Universe With one blow?If there was some way to punch the whole universe, probably, but since he could only hit one planet at a time, no. Can Goku?

What did hulk lift that weighted 150 billion tons?An entire mountain range, the scan of it is all over the Bdome.

Is way faster than the speed of light (goku SSJ3) WAY WAY Slower than the speed of light? (silver surfer and the Flash)Goku's fighting speed is sub-lightspeed, Flash and SS are so beyond that it isn't even funny.

All those answers are for regular Hulk. War Hulk is like Regular Hulk, gone SSJ10.

[kapsi]

I'd like the scan of Hulk taking genki dama in the face and not caring, kthx.

[Kamendex]

I dont think regeneration should count i think thats weak...
If they both had unlimited energy so that war hulk could regenerate forever, if Goku had the power to vapourise him he would also be able to do that forever. Thus it ends as stalemate but clearly war hulk has lost...
Hears my arguments for this massive thread lol...

Goku is a skilled warrior and martial artist with speed far surpassing basically anyone anywhere in any anime or american comic (poss excl. the flash but thats a discussion for a different battledome). He is also the strongest in his anime where to even be considered a threat you have to basically be able to blow up a planet with a finger and regenerate in some way or another (for the DBZ crew it was the dragonballs...). Goku ALWAYS gets stronger during his fights ALWAYS. An if its not due to him gettin beat down its because something or someone important to him is in danger.

The war hulk is not a character i know much about but going by the hulk an the little i do know i would say war hulk is a creature using raw power with speed incomparable to Videl let alone Goku lol. I hear rumours that he can regenerate from mere molecules but how long does that take? an also im sure that if the molecule of your enemy was floating about goku would have the brains to zap it one more time. Also i heard in this discussion about war hulk being comparable to celestial beings with his sword an the CB are greater than Goku. What a load of trash its all relative. I think all marvel/DC characters or watever fight their respective gods/CBs at one point jus when there own storyline runs out an the writer needs something to do. I pretty sure spiderman faced a CB at one point and one but does anyone here think that spiderman could beat goku!?!

War hulk would not be able to touch Goku an im not even talking about from a power perspective im talking about speed, if you cant catch it you cant hit it and im sure that Goku would figure out a way to put war hulk down or wear him out long enough jus to pile drive him with energy. And if war hulk ever threatened the earth or gokus family it would jus increase gokus power, i dont know of any attributes like that for War Hulk as far as im concerned hes jus big strong and angry lol.

Anyway as you can see i prefer DBZ/GT, i always found those muscle fights of the hulk boring and slow but hey if all else fails we can jus look at the results of the poll cant we...


I stopped reading your ridiculous post after the second paragraph.....Gokuu having speed far surpassing anyone in anime comic or anime? That is so stupid....Gokuu is slower than SSj Gotenks who went around the world a few times and took a short nap and ALL of that took him 29 minutes....Light Speed is around the world 7 times in a SECOND....Gokuu is nowhere NEAR light speed...Flash and SS rape him in light speed. Strongest in his own anime? Umm not even CLOSE.

SSj2 Vegitto
HUGE Gap
Super Buu 3
Gap
Super Buu 2
Big Gap
Chou Gohan
Medium/Small Gap
SSj3 Gotenks
Gap
Super Buu 1.5
Small Gap
Super Buu
Big Gap
SSj Gotenks
Medium Gap
FPSSj3 Gokuu
Gap
Fat Buu
Gap
Kid Buu, Evil Buu

Gokuu is nowhere NEAR strongest in his own anime.....

Don't decide a matchup on what you prefer....you use your head buddy. War Hulk caught SS's board....SS>>>>>>>>>>>>times 1 million>Gokuu in speed.

[Gooba]

I'd like the scan of Hulk taking genki dama in the face and not caring, kthx.There are either 2 possibilities, it hits War Hulk in the face, and doesn't damage him. Judging by normal Hulk's toughness, and the fact that War Hulk is a celestial version of him, it is entirely possible. The other possibility is that it blows his head completely off, and then he regrows it in a few seconds, and doesn't care.

[Final Ultima]

Why, oh why must this topic continue to exist? -_-;

[Gooba]

Why, oh why must this topic continue to exist? -_-;DBZ fans who have not read the whole thread. :P

[GTOnizukadude]

20 pages... of explaining why Goku gets the crap kicked out of him. And Hulk's losing in the polls. wtf?

[Bullet]

Stalemate? Goku doesn't have unlimited energy, we've seen him tire many times to the point of not being able to stand up, and it didn't take very long. Hulk has limitless endurance. As for regeneration not counting, thats a stupid argument, it can make all the difference in a fight so of course it counts.



Ha, dude I've got news for you, there are a lot of people in American comics with speed surpassing Goku. He's not really that powerful compared to a lot of beings in american comics.

Secondly we've never seen him destroy a planet (Vegeta doing it with a finger was filler I believe). Now as for Goku getting stronger during a fight, big deal, its very limited from what I've seen, the Hulk gets stronger at a much faster rate.



You just admitted you know nothing about War Hulk. Hulk can regenerate at insane speeds, so don't underestimate that. As for running out of storyline, are you actually comparing the story of the Hulk to DBZ? Hulk is far superior in the storyline department.

DBZ = super powerful being appears, heros train, big drawn out fight with many power ups, heros win, lather rinse repeat.

Hulk is a psychological story of a man searching for peace within himself, a man just trying to live his life with a raging beast within him always trying to get out.

And yes, War Hulk is on the celestial level, regardless of what you think about it, you can't deny that just because you don't like it. Suppose I think the saiyan ability to become stronger from recovery is trash, can I just ignore that then?



Dude, Hulk can perceive speedsters, he can see things moving at super speeds like the silver surfer, his mind can follow them easily and in some cases he can keep up with them (like when he pulled the surfer off his board).

Goku would only succeed in pissing the Hulk off, thus making him stronger and stronger. As for wearing Hulk down, never going to happen, as long as he is mad he never tires. He'll just keep getting stronger, more durable and more able to regenerate as Goku tries to "wear him down".

And you just admitted again you know nothing about War Hulk. We've seen people (Juggernaut) who in terms of physical power are FAR beyond Goku fail to even scratch him.



ROFL, how many fights have you seen? I'm willing to bet NONE. If all his fights were just "slow muscle fights" it wouldn't have been as popular as it has been for decades. Lets see if DBZ is still popular in 40 years.

DBZ fights are just power ups and stupid displays of power.



When will people read what I post, there is NO LIMIT to the Hulk's anger, this has been acknowledged by many people in the marvel universe including the beyonder who was powerful enough to occupy a universe alone and possessed near omniscience. He acknowleged the infinite potential of the Hulk's power.

As for Genki Dama, Hulk is not going to do what DBZ villains do and sit there going "oh shit, he's charging an attack, I better stand here and twitch my face". He'll throw buildings, cars and rocks if he can't reach Goku, and also the Genki Dama is slow, I don't care what anyone says, from what we've seen its a slow fucking attack. Hulk would just move out of the way.



Well this proves you have no idea what you're talking about. Goku has never shown ANYTHING to indicate he's anywhere near the speed of light without his teleporation.

Light takes 8 minutes to get from the sun to the earth, Silver Surfer can cross galaxies in an instant, sounds pretty fucking far beyond the speed of light to me.

The Flash can go so fast he goes backwards through time and phases into other dimensions, sounds pretty far beyond the speed of light to me.

Nicely done man!:cool :thumbs :clap

[Green Lantern]

Man oh man I wish I did not create this thread :P
(I honestly did not know that Goku would be raped so badly :P)

[Ssj3_Goku]

Intresting i remeber goku saying that kid buu is stronger and faster than he was in his last form ( the form im talking about is super buu the one with evil and good mixed)

plus all those guys u listed OVER HALF are with fusion shit.

[tdultima]

heres hulk getting stripped down by advanced bugs

it takes him 18 minutes to fully regenerate and he is still in one piece

not invincible is he?

show me evidence that hulk can instantly regenerate from disintegration

freeza can destroy planets and cell can destroy the solar system

so why cant goku disintegrate him?

since when has hulk ever been hit point blank by a planet busting energy beam?

why cant goku shoot him into the sun?

why cant goku shoot the ENTIRE PLANET into the sun?

http://img15.photobucket.com/albums/v44/guyverjay/The_End_18.jpg

http://img15.photobucket.com/albums/v44/guyverjay/The_End_19.jpg

http://img15.photobucket.com/albums/v44/guyverjay/The_End_20.jpg

[Dark Shadow]

Yeah that is powerful.

Quoting someone's post, Goku might be fast enough to evade the Hulk, but still he has not much of a chance. Of course he could attempt to do a Kamehameha in the air, but the Earth would be destroyed, and Hulk can jump extremely high.

But then, what would happen if Goku simply punched Hulk fast enough, then teleported somewhere else and punched him again? Like a speed attack..

[Gooba]

But then, what would happen if Goku simply punched Hulk fast enough, then teleported somewhere else and punched him again? Like a speed attack..Eventually grab Goku and squish him into a pulp. He can react with superspeed.

[Othni]

Hulks reflexes are althletic level. If spiderman can avoid getting hit, then I'm sure goku can as well.

[Gooba]

Hulks reflexes are althletic level. If spiderman can avoid getting hit, then I'm sure goku can as well.No they are not, he grabbed the Silver Surfer off his surfboard, and he is millions(billions) of times faster than Goku.

[Kamendex]

Intresting i remeber goku saying that kid buu is stronger and faster than he was in his last form ( the form im talking about is super buu the one with evil and good mixed)

plus all those guys u listed OVER HALF are with fusion shit.

Dude read the manga....Gokuu saying that was filler.....and it doesnt matter if they are fusions...they are STRONGER than Gokuu....that guy said Gokuu was the strongest in his own anime.

[tdultima]

Eventually grab Goku and squish him into a pulp. He can react with superspeed.

and i can easily say goku teleports right before hulk grabs him

theres no way goku can beat hulk in close combat

im talking about planet busting disintegration

[Ssj3_Goku]

Dude read the manga....Gokuu saying that was filler.....and it doesnt matter if they are fusions...they are STRONGER than Gokuu....that guy said Gokuu was the strongest in his own anime.

yea i am reading the manga even the shonen jump version as well..

Doesnt matter? well 2 ppl it takes to be stronger than 1 thats my point. Only person by himself that was acculy stronger than goku was gohon but we dont know if thats the case after the 10 year training goku did after the buu saga when gohon was on his ass.

Goku is the STrongest Super Sayien in his own world No one by them selves can go Super Sayein 3. So in super sayien termms Goku is stronger.

and about the vegeta thing when i said about his finger correct u are but his galant gun was strong enough to destroy the planent and that is in the sayein saga. plus since it takes 18 mins for the hulk to regenerate from bugs! LOL it took buu like split seconds to reform after he got blown up by a planent. oo and just to quote the maker of this thread.

Firstly I need to make a big point-
This match is WAR HULK

Not Maestro Hulk!!

War Hulk does not have Silver Surfers board,

and Maestro Hulk, Not War Hulk, was the one who came back from atoms
Maestro Hulk is the ultimate form of Hulk because he has absorbed many years worth of radiation, and because he has the mind of Bruce Banner

So when you say that Hulk has been vaporised into atoms, you are incorrect- War Hulk was not vaporised into atoms, Maestro was, and it is War Hulk who is in this match

Also to the Goku people saying that Goku could blow up the planet etc, Note the beginning of the match in which I stated: No planetary destruction

Pay attention to details and get your facts straight!

so ppl dont bring other stuff into this fight.

So yea i can see one of gokus strong kamehamahas blowing the hulk away so much that he cannot regenerate. and ssj3 can defintly do that. hell look at what ssj2 gohon did to cell..

[Tsukiyomi]

heres hulk getting stripped down by advanced bugs

it takes him 18 minutes to fully regenerate and he is still in one piece

Two things wrong with that, first off "The End" was a what if, it can hardly be considered Canon.

Secondly, he bugs attacked BANNER whose body turned into the Hulk to avoid dying. The transformation between Banner and the Hulk is variable, it can take anywhere from a few seconds to many minutes. Its entirely possible with 200 years of radiation that the time frame changed and that entire 18 minutes was a combination of Banner becoming the hulk and a watered down healing factor due to the fact the Hulk hadn't fully emerged.

The Hulk has regenerated his entire body in seconds, what sense would it make for his fully powered healing factor to take so long for a minor injury?

not invincible is he?

Who said he was "invincible"? I'm saying Goku can't kill him, nothing Goku has shown can kill the Hulk or even hurt him in the long run.

show me evidence that hulk can instantly regenerate from disintegration

Show me evidence of Goku disintegrating ANYTHING by his OWN POWER...oh wait... he never did, gee I guess he can't.

Just because we didn't see it happen doesn't mean it can't be reasoned out, the Hulk has regenerated his entire body in seconds and recovered from being disintegrated. Now we're talking about that power on a celestial level, I see no reason he couldn't.

freeza can destroy planets and cell can destroy the solar system

Bullshit, I don't think Cell knew what he was talking about. The earth averages a width of 8,000 miles, so lets say thats the size of a planet being destroyed. The power to destroy a planet would destroy something 8,000 miles wide.

The sun alone is 800,000 miles across, meaning just to get to the sun without anything else would require a power 100 times greater than that required to destroy a planet.

The distance from the earth to the sun is roughly 93,000,000 miles, meaning just to fill the distance between the earth and the sun with planet destroying energy (not including the earth and sun itself) would require a power roughly 11,500 times greater than that required to destroy a planet.

Now, thats just the earth from the sun in a straight line, you would be required to fill the entire area around the sun on all sides to this distance with planet destroying force.

Pluto is about 3,600,000,000 miles from the sun, try to wrap your mind around the power it would take to fill that space with planet destroying energy.

Now Vegeta needed a power of roughly 40,000 to attempt to destroy the earth (he probably would have succeeded). Now 40,000 * 3.6 billion = 144,000,000,000,000 to just fill that space.

The combined width of the sun and pluto is around 860,000 miles, making the total distance (one side straight line) about 3,600,860,000, which would require a power level of 144,034,400,000,000 to fill. Now thats just one side of the solar system in a straight line, imagine filling the whole thing to destroy it.

If you think cell had that kind of power you're insane.

so why cant goku disintegrate him?

Because Hulk's durability and healing factor would keep him together longer than Goku could maintain a stream of energy.

since when has hulk ever been hit point blank by a planet busting energy beam?

Ummm..gladiator, did you not see the example above?

why cant goku shoot him into the sun?

*sigh*, I'll say it again, its been tried. A lot of people have tried to send the Hulk into space, it never ends well for them.

Goku is dealing with an almost cosmic force.

why cant goku shoot the ENTIRE PLANET into the sun?

When has he EVER moved ANYTHING even REMOTELY the size of the earth?

[Gooba]

it takes 18 mins for the hulk to regenerate from bugs!Normal Hulk, as you said in your post, this is War Hulk, who is ridiculously better than that one. Also, Regular Hulk regenerated from nothing but bones in about 10 seconds.

^:hi5

[Ssj3_Goku]

Well lets bring back when vegeta was having flashbacks with his dad and his crew his dad destroyed a couple of plants with his power and that was WAYY back....


plus goku did desinigrate alot of stuff wayy back in freaking dragonball... Plus the fact still remains Gohon COMPLEATLY desinigrated cell and Vegeta said that goku was stronger than gohon when goku went ssj2 .. so guess what he can surely unleash enough power to disengrate the hulk.

Normal Hulk, as you said in your post, this is War Hulk, who is ridiculously better than that one. Also, Regular Hulk regenerated from nothing but bones in about 10 seconds.

^:hi5


bones? umm cell came back from just 1 cell in matter of seconds soo yea that beatrs ur war hulk regeneration.

Buu regenerated back from a PLANET EXPLOSION in a matter of seconds :hi5 .... soo yea they where both compleatly gone skeletons encluded just that it was not enough power to take them out.

plus tsu u dont know whats cell is talking about when he said that? well its in the manga so u got to deal with it.

[Gooba]

bones? umm cell came back from just 1 cell in matter of seconds soo yea that beatrs ur war hulk regeneration.No, that beats my normal Hulk regeneration, War Hulk is celestially better than that. We have never seen the actual rate he would heal, as he has never even been scratched.

plus tsu u dont know whats cell is talking about when he said that? well its in the manga so u got to deal with it.He said it in the manga, but that doesn't mean it is the truth. People can lie in mangas, they do it all the time.

[Ssj3_Goku]

^ and never blown up from a planet either.. war hulk did nto regenerate from atoms i quoted the thread maker saying that.. soo war hulks regenration is not as good as cells or buus .. Until i see war hulk get blown up from a planet and come back in mer seconds then i will change my mind. but he did not Cell did and Buu did .

[Othni]

No they are not, he grabbed the Silver Surfer off his surfboard, and he is millions(billions) of times faster than Goku.

Wasn't that the Maestro? 0.^ And also, silver surfer was running away and he was catching up to him and then caught it, no? I'm talking about reflexes as in someone is zooming around you and you have to actually spin around and what not. that type of reflex

[Gooba]

war hulk did nto regenerate from atoms i quoted the thread maker saying that.. soo war hulks regenration is not as good as cells or buus .. Until i see war hulk get blown up from a planet and come back in mer seconds then i will change my mind. but he did not Cell did and Buu did .He only didn't because blasts like those didn't hurt him. I never saw a gun shoot through a piece of paper, but that doesn't mean it can't.

[Ssj3_Goku]

^ ooo boy then i can come up with alot of stuff for goku if we go like that.

[Bullet]

^ ooo boy then i can come up with alot of stuff for goku if we go like that.

SSJ3/4 Goku will lose pretty easy. Hes not close to even being physically a match for the Hulk at all. One punch from the Hulk will put ssj3/4 Goku in a coma. Goku isn't strong enough to even fase Hulk with physical attacks, so he can speedbiltz all he wants until Hulk hits him one time. And his ssj3/4 transformation takes up way to much energy that the fight won't last very long at all.

Gokus kamehameha wave takes to long too, Hulk isn't going to stand there and let him charge up the attack; it wouldn't matter anyways, as Hulk has taken a blast from Gladiator whos Eye beam is hotter than stars (sun). I don't think Goku will destroy the planet just to kill the Hulk anyways, and I'm sure Hulk will survive the blast also. And like I said, planet destroying attacks isn't all that immpressive, as the planet has a life force, damage the planet, and it'll automatically destroy itself. Plus there's no way to tell how hard it is to blow up a planet since you have nothing to compare it to. For all we know that blast from Vector is more powerful than the DBZ/GT characters planet busting blast. If you take away there planet destroying blasts, they're really not all that impressive.

[Ssj3_Goku]

^ ummm well goku can be in the air start up the kamehamaha hulk trys and throw something at him he uses instant transmission then baam war hulk gets blasted..
plus about hotter than the sun.. in DBZ their beam abilities is not based on heat just raw power.

but u see all dbz was , fast melee action , blazing speed and super strong blast attacks.. if i took away the hulks ability to lift an island he would not really be that impressive either.


the thing is goku is a fighting genious where the hulk is just some big green guy with a bad temper ..

plus saying i dont think goku would blow up the planent blah blah.. if it was just him and the hulk on the planet and no oneelse i am sure he would. but like the thread creator stated no planetary destruction in this battle.

[konflikti]

^ ummm well goku can be in the air start up the kamehamaha hulk trys and throw something at him he uses instant transmission then baam war hulk gets blasted..
plus about hotter than the sun.. in DBZ their beam abilities is not based on heat just raw power.

but u see all dbz was , fast melee action , blazing speed and super strong blast attacks.. if i took away the hulks ability to lift an island he would not really be that impressive either.


the thing is goku is a fighting genious where the hulk is just some big green guy with a bad temper ..

plus saying i dont think goku would blow up the planent blah blah.. if it was just him and the hulk on the planet and no oneelse i am sure he would. but like the thread creator stated no planetary destruction in this battle.You fail to realize that Goku can't survive in the space, unlike Hulk. Destruction of planet would be suicide, and IT away would be running away and therefore loss.

Btw, if you really wanna count their beam attacks on being just raw power, then Hulk has got nothing to worry about. Because no one in DBZ comes even close to Hulk's raw power. It's enough to break rules of physics. He'll probably hit the kamehameha right back at Goku's face if he feels like it.

The thing is this: Goku is a fighting genious matched against gamma-engine of unlimited physical power, regeneration and stamina.You can be all the martial arts genious you want but it ain't gonna help you much if you get ran over a truck. "Hulk smash puny Saiyan!"

[korican04]

heres hulk getting stripped down by advanced bugs

it takes him 18 minutes to fully regenerate and he is still in one piece

not invincible is he?

show me evidence that hulk can instantly regenerate from disintegration

freeza can destroy planets and cell can destroy the solar system

so why cant goku disintegrate him?

since when has hulk ever been hit point blank by a planet busting energy beam?

why cant goku shoot him into the sun?

why cant goku shoot the ENTIRE PLANET into the sun?
http://img15.photobucket.com/albums/v44/guyverjay/The_End_18.jpg

http://img15.photobucket.com/albums/v44/guyverjay/The_End_19.jpg

http://img15.photobucket.com/albums/v44/guyverjay/The_End_20.jpg
That was from the End and I remember reading that, for one he was attacked as banner, and then he turned to the the hulk, that's why it took him a while to regenerate, that was also off the timeline of marvel. Because of being between transformation his healing factor was not at full power, presumably (i don't quite remember all the details).

War Hulk the one we are talkig about, from the stuff i have read wouldn't get hurt so easily with his "celestial" enhancement or whatever.
People have tried to send the regular hulk into space, cause they couldn't beat him then they go their asses handed to them.

arg: I'm way late, tsykuomi already replied.

[Othni]

Cosmic spiderman sent hulk into out space with one punch. He didn't fail. :) Yeah yeah, he was a cosmic, but I'm just saying that the whole No one has sent him into out space' thing is wrong.

[tdultima]

Show me evidence of Goku disintegrating ANYTHING by his OWN POWER...oh wait... he never did, gee I guess he can't.

Just because we didn't see it happen doesn't mean it can't be reasoned out, the Hulk has regenerated his entire body in seconds and recovered from being disintegrated. Now we're talking about that power on a celestial level, I see no reason he couldn't.

not true it took 10 years for the maestro to recover from disintegration and with help from hulk

and since that is the only example ill go by that

Bullshit, I don't think Cell knew what he was talking about. The earth averages a width of 8,000 miles, so lets say thats the size of a planet being destroyed. The power to destroy a planet would destroy something 8,000 miles wide.

The sun alone is 800,000 miles across, meaning just to get to the sun without anything else would require a power 100 times greater than that required to destroy a planet.

The distance from the earth to the sun is roughly 93,000,000 miles, meaning just to fill the distance between the earth and the sun with planet destroying energy (not including the earth and sun itself) would require a power roughly 11,500 times greater than that required to destroy a planet.

Now, thats just the earth from the sun in a straight line, you would be required to fill the entire area around the sun on all sides to this distance with planet destroying force.

Pluto is about 3,600,000,000 miles from the sun, try to wrap your mind around the power it would take to fill that space with planet destroying energy.

Now Vegeta needed a power of roughly 40,000 to attempt to destroy the earth (he probably would have succeeded). Now 40,000 * 3.6 billion = 144,000,000,000,000 to just fill that space.

The combined width of the sun and pluto is around 860,000 miles, making the total distance (one side straight line) about 3,600,860,000, which would require a power level of 144,034,400,000,000 to fill. Now thats just one side of the solar system in a straight line, imagine filling the whole thing to destroy it.

If you think cell had that kind of power you're insane.

dont try to use science to explain comic books

stuff in marvel can be equally insane

cell said he could destroy the solar system right before gohan killed him so naturally the author made him say that to show gohan's power

Ummm..gladiator, did you not see the example above?

gladiator's eyebeam isn't a planet destroying energy beam

its a small beam that cut a hole in the hulk's chest



*sigh*, I'll say it again, its been tried. A lot of people have tried to send the Hulk into space, it never ends well for them.

thats your only excuse

those people tried and failed because a plot device protects hulk

When has he EVER moved ANYTHING even REMOTELY the size of the earth?

blow up the earth in the direction of the sun

[Heartgobbler]

I'd say Goku would win but he would have to use his brain. He couldn't damage Hulk fast enough to overcome his regeneration (except perhaps for cutting him with a kienzan ) but he could use his speed/ teleportation to get rid of him (say, leaving him in open space. The greatest strenght won't help you if you have nothing to interact with)

Taking that he can absorb radiation, throwing Hulk into the Sun might actually be a bad idea.:oh

[Shiron]

but he could use his speed/ teleportation to get rid of him (say, leaving him in open space. The greatest strenght won't help you if you have nothing to interact with)

That won't work though. First of all Goku can't survive in space, but the War Hulk can. Secondly, Goku can only teleport where there's a ki signature to lock onto; nowhere else. - MnK

[Kamendex]

Dude....SSj3_Goku.....stoping using your BS Dragonball info to confuse people...Cell didnt come back with one cell remaining in a SECOND....it took him a awhile....heck it took him long enough to come back from HALF of his body being destroyed that almost everyone thought he was DEAD....

BTW....stop using the destroying solar system crap...it has as much truth to it as Vegeta saying he was the strongest in the universe in the Saiya-jin saga....which was obviously not true.

And did you see how long it took for Cell to come up with enough energy for that kamehameha....use your head...the Hulk is not gonna stand there and let him charge....

[tdultima]

look here some gun made by forge can kill the hulk (it damaged him badly)

the gamma bomb killed the maestro

so why not a big planet busting beam?





Device name: Forge’s Anti-Hulk Gun

Designed and built by: Forge

Used by: The Maestro

Capabilities: Energy weapon designed expressly for the purpose of killing the Hulk.

Limitations: It takes several shots for it to kill the Hulk.

Used against the Hulk in: Future Imperfect #2 (Merged Hulk)

Intended outcomes: Kill the Hulk.

Actual outcome(s): The gun was very effective in wounding the Hulk. In one powerful shot he was bleeding. There was no chance for the Maestro to use the weapon for a second time, thus never demonstrating whether it really could kill the Hulk.

Effectiveness rating: Good

Explanation for rating: It severely wounded the Hulk in one shot, as it was expected to do.

First appearance: (Actually) Future Imperfect #2, (chronologically) Incredible Hulk v2 #455


http://www.gammabase.com/index.php?weaponry/forgesgun.php

[Kamendex]

A gun SPECIFICALLY made to kill the Hulk....wow...so if let's say Dr. Gero made a potion that was specifically made to kill Gokuu....and it did....does that mean Gokuu is so weak that a mere potion can kill him? Or would you use your head and say he was killed by a potion SPECIFICALLY made to kill him....?

[Heartgobbler]

That won't work though. First of all Goku can't survive in space, but the War Hulk can. Secondly, Goku can only teleport where there's a ki signature to lock onto; nowhere else. - MnK

Goku cannot survive without air ,but he can hold his breath for long enough (which he demonstrated while repairing the ship during his travel to Namek)

Could you explain further this stuff about ki signature?

one more thing: Since Hulk regenerates to the level of near immortality. If you cut off his head, does he regenerate from the head or from the torso? (or will there be two of them? )

[Shiron]

look here some gun made by forge can kill the hulk (it damaged him badly)

the gamma bomb killed the maestro

so why not a big planet busting beam?





Device name: Forge’s Anti-Hulk Gun

Designed and built by: Forge

Used by: The Maestro

Capabilities: Energy weapon designed expressly for the purpose of killing the Hulk.

Limitations: It takes several shots for it to kill the Hulk.

Used against the Hulk in: Future Imperfect #2 (Merged Hulk)

Intended outcomes: Kill the Hulk.

Actual outcome(s): The gun was very effective in wounding the Hulk. In one powerful shot he was bleeding. There was no chance for the Maestro to use the weapon for a second time, thus never demonstrating whether it really could kill the Hulk.

Effectiveness rating: Good

Explanation for rating: It severely wounded the Hulk in one shot, as it was expected to do.

First appearance: (Actually) Future Imperfect #2, (chronologically) Incredible Hulk v2 #455


http://www.gammabase.com/index.php?weaponry/forgesgun.php
So? That's a special kind of gun and a special kind of radiation. Goku has access to neither. Even if the fight is taking place in the Hulk's world, Goku wouln't know that those would work on him and if Goku did figure it out the Hulk certainly wouldn't let Goku get access to those weapons. - MnK

EDIT: A ki attack wouldn't work because it doesn't contain gamma radiation and as said before, the Hulk wouldn't just sit there for 5 minutes and let Goku charge a Kamehameha Wave stong enough to destroy him, which Goku couldn't make anyways.

EDIT 2: Heartgobbler: Goku can only teleport to where there is an actual living being is what that means.

[Kamendex]

Goku cannot survive without air ,but he can hold his breath for long enough (which he demonstrated while repairing the ship during his travel to Namek)

Could you explain further this stuff about ki signature?

That was filler my friend...

[Heartgobbler]

Still, is superman can fly in space by holding his breath, so should Goku.

[tdultima]

A ki attack wouldn't work because it doesn't contain gamma radiation and as said before, the Hulk wouldn't just sit there for 5 minutes and let Goku charge a Kamehameha Wave stong enough to destroy him, which Goku couldn't make anyways.

that small eyebeam from gladiator doesnt have gamma radiation either, how come it damaged the hulk?

as for hulk wouldnt let goku charge up a beam...goku can teleport while charging

buu shot goku while he was charging the genki dama and goku teleported to avoid the attack, came back, and continued charging

and what evidence is there that hulk can take a planet destroying energy beam?

any examples?

[Gooba]

any examples?War took Gladiators and was only damaged, and that version is ridiculously weaker than the one in this fight.

Still, is superman can fly in space by holding his breath, so should Goku.If the Human Torch can ignite himself at will, should Goku be able to?

[Shiron]

that small eyebeam from gladiator doesnt have gamma radiation either, how come it damaged the hulk?

as for hulk wouldnt let goku charge up a beam...goku can teleport while charging

buu shot goku while he was charging the genki dama and goku teleported to avoid the attack, came back, and continued charging

and what evidence is there that hulk can take a planet destroying energy beam?

any examples?
What I meant by that was that the Hulk would just regenerate from the attack after it hit him, causing no permanent damage to him. I didn't mean that it would have no effect at all.

I personally, can't give you any examples. However, just comletely read this thread and any others about the Hulk (that's how I know what I currently know about the Hulk, since I don't read American comics) for examples of his strength/durabillity/regeneration feats. - MnK

[tdultima]

well i can give an example

it took the maestro 10 years to regenerate disintegration from the gamma bomb and thats with hulk giving him gamma radiation

that means he needs help

listen going down for 10 years = loss in my book

[Gooba]

well i can give an example

it took the maestro 10 years to regenerate disintegration from the gamma bomb and thats with hulk giving him gamma radiation

that means he needs help

listen going down for 10 years = loss in my bookThat is special because it is his weakness. It is like saying hitting Superman with a normal rock will kill him, because doing it with Kryptonite will.

[tdultima]

War took Gladiators and was only damaged, and that version is ridiculously weaker than the one in this fight.

i said a planet destroying energy beam

did hulk ever get hit point blank by a HUGE energy beam capable of destroying a planet?

when did gladiator destroy a planet with that tiny little eyebeam?

[braindx]

Still, is superman can fly in space by holding his breath, so should Goku.

OMFG, are you shitting me? That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Do you know what happens to people in space? The vacuum starts sucking stuff out of the orifaces in the body... so first, your eyes pop out of your head and your eye sockets and ear drums will start bleeding pretty badly. That's not to mention you'd probably die pretty fast considering the temperature of space is about a mere ~4 Kelvin (That's -269 Celsius).

Anyway, no one can survive in space except people with super generation (Cell, Buu, Hulk, etc.), special powers (Green Lantern, superman, etc.) or celestial/cosmic power (Silver Surfer, etc.).

buu shot goku while he was charging the genki dama and goku teleported to avoid the attack, came back, and continued charging

Filler. Heh. Everytime I see your posts there is at least one comment with filler in it. Go read the manga.

well i can give an example

it took the maestro 10 years to regenerate disintegration from the gamma bomb and thats with hulk giving him gamma radiation

that means he needs help

listen going down for 10 years = loss in my book

The fact that he can come back from total disintegration (which no one in DBZ has done because they have to have at least pieces of themselves or a cell), makes his regenerative abilities better than Cell's and Buu's (which they already are anyway). Stop bring this up because it is only hurting your case.

i said a planet destroying energy beam

did hulk ever get hit point blank by a HUGE energy beam capable of destroying a planet?

when did gladiator destroy a planet with that tiny little eyebeam?

Okay, seriously. The only instances it has been shown in the manga where people blow up planets are Frieza's destruction of Namek (Volume 27, Chapt 7, Page 9) and Buu's destruction of earth (Volume 42, Chapt 6, Page 9). Those "planet destroying beams" were actually balls of energy much like the Genki Dama and they weren't that big at all. The radius of Frieza's was the largest probably about ~10 meters across at most and Buu's ball of energy was just bigger than his body.

The fact that Gladiators "tiny eye beam" can destroy planets and stars makes it far stronger than Frieza's or Buu's planet destroying balls of energy.

Use the edit button, it is your friend -Gooba

[Kamendex]

Actually...Gokuu teleporting to dodge Kid Buu's BLAST was not filler.....although...how is he gonna stand there and keep teleporting if Hulk comes and starts punching him? His Instaneous Movement is limited to his energy....

[braindx]

Actually...Gokuu teleporting to dodge Kid Buu's BLAST was not filler.....although...how is he gonna stand there and keep teleporting if Hulk comes and starts punching him? His Instaneous Movement is limited to his energy....

Okay, Volume 42, Chap 14, Pic 2... His body blurs on the bottom middle panel to dodge Buu's blast... but it CAN'T be instant transmission (IT) because there is no one around him to lock his Ki onto AND he stays in virtually the same place he was up in the air before Buu fired the blast. Additionally, he doesn't have the ability to touch his forehead and focus which we've seen he must do each and every time he wants to IT. He HAS to have just sidestepped it quickly.

Gooba, Thanks for merging my posts. Using the quick reply was easier than using the edit button. :P

[Bullet]

i said a planet destroying energy beam

did hulk ever get hit point blank by a HUGE energy beam capable of destroying a planet?

when did gladiator destroy a planet with that tiny little eyebeam?

Gladiator's Eyebeam is hotter than stars (it's hotter than the sun itself, which at the core temperature can reach 22.5 million degrees). None of the DBZ/GT characters attacks come close to that.

Here's a scan that stats that Gladiators Heat Vision is hotter than a star.

http://img397.imageshack.us/img397/6526/heata4um.jpg

Here's Gladiator destroying stars with his bare hands and eye beam with no problem.

http://img397.imageshack.us/img397/3168/destroyingworld4tp.jpg

http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/5551/planetsmash26fy.jpg

Here's Hulk taking a planet destroying blast from Vector.

http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/9107/vector20pk3ds.jpg

Here's Vector putting more power into his planet destroying attack.

http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/986/vector38og4jk.jpg

http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/7926/vector3a0dn5pa.jpg

Here he is healing in a sec after the attack.

http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/7342/healing6ly.jpg

And here he is taking a star destroying blast from Gladiator.

http://img387.imageshack.us/img387/1081/theincrediblehulkannual1997177.jpg

Stars are far bigger than Earth, but Hulk just walk right through Gladiator blast. Goku dies.

[tdultima]

The fact that he can come back from total disintegration (which no one in DBZ has done because they have to have at least pieces of themselves or a cell), makes his regenerative abilities better than Cell's and Buu's (which they already are anyway). Stop bring this up because it is only hurting your case.

10 years = loss

ok ill ask you to show me an example when hulk has come back from a cell

since cell and buu really suck show me hulk coming back from a cell

Okay, seriously. The only instances it has been shown in the manga where people blow up planets are Frieza's destruction of Namek (Volume 27, Chapt 7, Page 9) and Buu's destruction of earth (Volume 42, Chapt 6, Page 9). Those "planet destroying beams" were actually balls of energy much like the Genki Dama and they weren't that big at all. The radius of Frieza's was the largest probably about ~10 meters across at most and Buu's ball of energy was just bigger than his body.

The fact that Gladiators "tiny eye beam" can destroy planets and stars makes it far stronger than Frieza's or Buu's planet destroying balls of energy.

i have yet to see any example of the gladiator destroying a star with his eyebeams

all i see are pics of him punching a moon or planet which is no big deal since freeza can already destroy planets

Okay, Volume 42, Chap 14, Pic 2... His body blurs on the bottom middle panel to dodge Buu's blast... but it CAN'T be instant transmission (IT) because there is no one around him to lock his Ki onto AND he stays in virtually the same place he was up in the air before Buu fired the blast. Additionally, he doesn't have the ability to touch his forehead and focus which we've seen he must do each and every time he wants to IT. He HAS to have just sidestepped it quickly.

so i was right

but you still deny it

what else can i say?

bullet:

Here's Gladiator destroying stars with his bare hands and eye beam with no problem.

like i keep saying thats not a star(sun) its either a planet or a moon

and his eyebeam didnt break it

he broke it with punches

Here's Hulk taking a planet destroying blast from Vector.

when has vector been shown to destroy planets?

he has the power to repel matter and hulk pushed against it

Guys, cut out all the DPs, seriously. Next one gets a 1 day "vacation" from here. Sorry, but it has gotten out of hand. -Gooba

[braindx]

The fact that he can come back from total disintegration (which no one in DBZ has done because they have to have at least pieces of themselves or a cell), makes his regenerative abilities better than Cell's and Buu's (which they already are anyway). Stop bring this up because it is only hurting your case.

10 years = loss

ok ill ask you to show me an example when hulk has come back from a cell

since cell and buu really suck show me hulk coming back from a cell

ROFL. I'll spell this out for you because it is pretty simple logic.

1. Hulk came back from total disintegration.
2. No character in DBZ can come back from total disintegration.
3. Therefore, Hulk's regeneration ability is superior.

Why would I show an example when Hulk comes back from a cell when Hulk coming back from atoms is even MORE impressive even if it takes longer??? This clearly shows that Hulk's regenerative abilities are superior overall (especially when factoring in his anger).


Okay, Volume 42, Chap 14, Pic 2... His body blurs on the bottom middle panel to dodge Buu's blast... but it CAN'T be instant transmission (IT) because there is no one around him to lock his Ki onto AND he stays in virtually the same place he was up in the air before Buu fired the blast. Additionally, he doesn't have the ability to touch his forehead and focus which we've seen he must do each and every time he wants to IT. He HAS to have just sidestepped it quickly.

so i was right

but you still deny it

what else can i say?

ROFL? That manga page proves you're WRONG. WRONG!!!!!! He doesn't use IT against Buu with the Genki Dama like YOU SAID!

Don't flame again, or you get a day break.

[tdultima]

ROFL. I'll spell this out for you because it is pretty simple logic.

1. Hulk came back from total disintegration.
2. No character in DBZ can come back from total disintegration.
3. Therefore, Hulk's regeneration ability is superior.

Why would I show an example when Hulk comes back from a cell when Hulk coming back from atoms is even MORE impressive even if it takes longer??? This clearly shows that Hulk's regenerative abilities are superior overall (especially when factoring in his anger).

cell and buu can INSTANTLY come back from a cell

show me the hulk doing the same

staying disintegrated for 10 years and needing HELP to recover isnt exactly a win (i thought this battle was one on one)

like i said if winning means hulk lives longer than hulk wins

[Shiron]

cell and buu can INSTANTLY come back from a cell

show me the hulk doing the same

staying disintegrated for 10 years and needing HELP to recover isnt exactly a win

like i said if winning means hulk lives longer than hulk wins
I remeber both Cell and Buu regennerating, but not instantly. Can you show me evidence of them doing such a thing? - MnK

[tdultima]

I remeber both Cell and Buu regennerating, but not instantly. Can you show me evidence of them doing such a thing? - MnK

a couple examples i can remember:

1. cell blew himself up when he puffed up like a balloon and came right back to rejoin the battle

2. vegeta sacrificed his life to disintegrate fat buu...buu came right back

3. buu blew himself up after destroying the earth then he regenerated and teleported to fight goku and vegeta (last battle)

[Shiron]

a couple examples i can remember:

1. cell blew himself up when he puffed up like a balloon and came right back to rejoin the battle

2. vegeta sacrificed his life to disintegrate fat buu...buu came right back

3. buu blew himself up after destroying the earth then he regenerated and teleported to fight goku and vegeta (last battle)
Yes, all of those were regenerations, but none of them were instant, like you claim them to be.

[tdultima]

Yes, all of those were regenerations, but none of them were instant, like you claim them to be.

fast enough to rejoin the battle then

but 10 years? come on now...

[Gooba]

but 10 years? come on now...10 years from being reduced to nothing, it took Cell and Buu, oh wait, they never came back from that.

[tdultima]

10 years from being reduced to nothing, it took Cell and Buu, oh wait, they never came back from that.

10 years with help

i thought this battle was one on one?

[Shiron]

10 years with help

i thought this battle was one on one?
So? If he didn't have help, it probably would have just taken him more time to fully regenerate. And Hulk would still be better than Cell and Buu, because, all though it took him a long amount of time, he still regenerated from less material than Buu and cell ever did. - MnK

[braindx]

Cell's regeneration isn't instant. It takes him approximately 5 manga pages to come back from blowing himself up (Vol 35, Ch5, Pg1-6) and the various characters carried out conversation(s) in that amount of time. Buu's regeneration is not instant either; it is basically a coagulation of his parts which take as long as it takes to get himself back together. Buu's first regen when he was killed by Vegita took 10 manga pages (Vol 39, Ch9, Pg1-10) and when he blew himself up with the earth took 8 pages (Vol42, Ch6-7, Pg12-13&1-6). Both seem to take minutes to come back from being blow apart. Hulk's regeneration is obviously superior as I've stated already since he can come back from basically nothing. But extrapolating from the various states of him being injured in the various comic pictures on the forum and in this thread, it should take a few minutes for him to regenerate all the way. Seeing as how he was reduced to a skeleton and came back from that in about 1-2 pages... and most of the weight of the body is not in the skeletal frame (approximately 18% of the body's weight). IF anything, they have the same regnerative abilities WHEN reduced to cells; however, Hulk has the trump card in that his increasing anger makes him regenerate faster.

[tdultima]

theres no example of how long it will take if the hulk was reduced to cells

i dont think there is even an example of decapitation

the one example of massive damage is the maestro being hit by a gamma bomb and it took 10 years and help to come back

its anyones guess

if you believe goku can destroy the hulk to the point of the gamma bomb with a very big energy beam or genki dama then goku wins

if you believe hulk regenerates from everything goku throws at him then the hulk wins and goku needs to teleport away before he gets killed

thats it i guess

[Gooba]

the one example of massive damage is the maestro being hit by a gamma bomb and it took 10 years and help to come backNo, there are others. Like him coming back in 5 seconds from being a skeleton.

[tdultima]

No, there are others. Like him coming back in 5 seconds from being a skeleton.

thats the fight with vector

he wasnt exactly a skeleton but a lot of his flesh and skin was ripped off

but its not disintegration

[braindx]

Considering that a skeleton is about ~18% of the body's weight, he technically should be able to regenerate his whole body in ~25 seconds from being reduced to cells which would be faster than Buu's and Cell's regenerations in the manga where it took them minutes.

[tdultima]

not a skeleton

he still has muscle, his brain is intact, guts still in place ect.

http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/2331/healing2ky3ga.jpg

[Gooba]

That was after he had healed a bunch from the page before.
http://img384.imageshack.us/img384/8097/vector3a0dn4rg4lw.jpg = basicly a skeleton

[tdultima]

theres still only one example of disintegration

if goku can duplicate the damage from the gamma bomb then he can win

if hulk regens from everything goku throws at him then goku is forced to leave or die

goku should still be the one on the offensive with his speed, IT, and long ranged attacks

[Tsukiyomi]

Holy crap, this is still ongoing?

theres still only one example of disintegration

I'm sorry there aren't multiple instances of the one weapon capable of disintegrating him.

if goku can duplicate the damage from the gamma bomb then he can win

And how exactly is he going to do that? Gamma radiation isn't something you can produce with a normal body.

if hulk regens from everything goku throws at him then goku is forced to leave or die

Thats exactly what will happen, Hulk will just keep regenerating. Notice gladiators beams were on him for a long time a point blank (the same beams that can destroy planets) and the small hole they made is quickly gone, you can't even tell it was there.

goku should still be the one on the offensive with his speed, IT, and long ranged attacks

Lets say hypothetically thats true, Goku doesn't have limitless Stamina, in fact his stamina hasn't really been shown to be too impressive and he's going up against someone who has limitless stamina and a healing factor which makes him immortal.

[tdultima]

I'm sorry there aren't multiple instances of the one weapon capable of disintegrating him.

thats not what i mean

hulk has been hurt by non gamma related attacks before

what about disintegration from non gamma related attacks?

whether goku is strong enough to do it is up to you...i believe goku has a chance

Notice gladiators beams were on him for a long time a point blank (the same beams that can destroy planets)

i continue to disagree on this

gladiator punched a planet

he didnt use eyebeams to blow up a planet

what im trying to say is dbz beams > gladiator beam

[Gooba]

This whole thing is unfair. You are debating normal Hulk vs Goku. I still think Hulk wins, but that is not the thread.

This is Goku vs War Hulk. If you are going to use normal Hulk then you need to use Goku from DB, not DBZ.

[EvilMoogle]

thats not what i mean

hulk has been hurt by non gamma related attacks before

what about disintegration from non gamma related attacks?
You see, that's the whole point the others are trying to make. There hasn't been an attack from a non-gamma related attack that is capable of disintegrating the Hulk.

The worst I've personally seen is the big hole in his chest from Gladiator, but I'm not the expert here.

Goku's got an uphill battle because he's got a ~6 minute time limit if I understand things correctly.

Taking a step back I'll try a different tactic. I propose that Goku would lose because he's far to into "testing" opponents. I think rather than going SSJ3 and bombing the Hulk from near-orbit, he'd end up charging in in his "normal" form to do a flurry of punches to see how the Hulk reacts, and the Hulk rather than doing a flurry of punches back like a normal DBZ opponent would just grab him and rip him apart...

Though that is rather anticlimactic ;)

[Tsukiyomi]

thats not what i mean

hulk has been hurt by non gamma related attacks before

what about disintegration from non gamma related attacks?

whether goku is strong enough to do it is up to you...i believe goku has a chance

Dude, what do you know about the Hulk storyline? He's taken blows from people capable of shattering planets and taken it, he's survived the apocalypse, he's immune to all forms of toxin and disease. Not only that, but his regenerative factor is immediate (unlike Cell's and Buu's which have a pause before they start which is why they were able to be destroyed).

The Gamma bomb is the only thing that has ever been able to hurt him to that extent and thats only because its like dropping a kryptonite powered atomic weapon on superman. And he still came back from that.

I've yet to see Goku actually destroy a planet. Show me an example of him doing this since you seem so interested in specific examples and not reasoning things out from other events.

i continue to disagree on this

gladiator punched a planet

he didnt use eyebeams to blow up a planet

what im trying to say is dbz beams > gladiator beam

Fine, lets say his eye beams can't do it. He still showed the physical strength to destroy a planet like it was nothing, yet on no occaision has Gladiator managed to beat the Hulk, this shows the Hulk can withstand planet destroying force.

[tdultima]

Dude, what do you know about the Hulk storyline? He's taken blows from people capable of shattering planets and taken it, he's survived the apocalypse, he's immune to all forms of toxin and disease. Not only that, but his regenerative factor is immediate (unlike Cell's and Buu's which have a pause before they start which is why they were able to be destroyed).

The Gamma bomb is the only thing that has ever been able to hurt him to that extent and thats only because its like dropping a kryptonite powered atomic weapon on superman. And he still came back from that.

I've yet to see Goku actually destroy a planet. Show me an example of him doing this since you seem so interested in specific examples and not reasoning things out from other events.

blows that can destroy a planet compared to cell who can destroy the solar system

you equally reject my claims even when i posted the page of cell saying that

even better is that ssj3 > ssj2 > cell

you will reject it of course

but i am forced to accept your claims without any evidence

[Archbob The Ninja]

At the end of Z. Goku could take a crap and it would destroy half the universe if he wanted it to.

Remember what the Supreme Kai said about Buu in the old days. Galaxies were eradicted because of Buu.

[Tsukiyomi]

blows that can destroy a planet compared to cell who can destroy the solar system

you equally reject my claims even when i posted the page of cell saying that

even better is that ssj3 > ssj2 > cell

you will reject it of course

but i am forced to accept your claims without any evidence

I still say Cell's claim was bullshit or a mistranslation. No one in DBZ has ever shown destructive power anywhere near that required to destroy a solar system.

At most they've destroyed a planet, even Majin Buu who was supposed to be the strongest villain (and had the opportunity to) never destroyed more than one planet at a time let alone, a solar system.

Lets say the claim of 300 killis being able to destroy a planet is true, Goku as an SS2 had 3,000, meaning he could destroy 10 around planets and he was far beyond cell, again thats still not taking into consideration the sun, the distance between planets or the overall space around a solar system.

[tdultima]

I still say Cell's claim was bullshit or a mistranslation. No one in DBZ has ever shown destructive power anywhere near that required to destroy a solar system.

At most they've destroyed a planet, even Majin Buu who was supposed to be the strongest villain (and had the opportunity to) never destroyed more than one planet at a time let alone, a solar system.

Lets say the claim of 300 killis being able to destroy a planet is true, Goku as an SS2 had 3,000, meaning he could destroy 10 around planets and he was far beyond cell, again thats still not taking into consideration the sun, the distance between planets or the overall space around a solar system.

mistranslation?

you are free to google it to confirm

trying to debunk it with science or reason is pointless its a manga

DRAGON BALL Z: Cell has enough chi to blow away the entire solar system, but Gohan won't give up!

http://www.emerchandise.com/product/MGS050001/s.gS71ltqh

Cell explains that he now has the power to gain strength from near
death experiences like a Saiyan; he may regenerate from a single cell
like Piccolo; and like Frieza, Cell may survive at any place. Cell now
plans to use his great power to destroy the entire solar system, rather
than just Earth.

http://www.pojo.com/dragonball/EpisodeSummaries/usdbz/USdbz175TheHorrorWontEnd.shtml

[Green Lantern]

How would you destroy empty space?

As to whether Goku could destroy planets-

Master Roshi was able to destroy the moon back in the original DB- master roshis power was about 500?
Frieza's power level at final form was more then 1 million- SS1 Goku was more then that, SS3 is much much more then that

so if you inject the maths into it, theoretically speaking Goku should be able to destroy a planet.

(Not saying that Goku could win, but explaining how it is possible for Goku to create a blast needed to destroy a planet)

To all the Goku people in here-

War Hulk has broken the laws of physics and stopped Juggernaut from moving (which is impossible in any other situation)

Laws of physics>>>>>>>>>>>>then anything Goku could do

Even nuclear weapons etc cannot stop Juggernaut from moving, only slow him down, as it is physically impossible in anysituation for Juggernaut to be stopped.

War Hulk stopped Juggernaut, and War Hulk can stop Goku.

[Tsukiyomi]

mistranslation?you are free to google it to confirm

Dude, I said it was either a mistranslation or bullshit, its entirely possible he couldn't really do that. Does it really make sense from two "solar system destroying" blasts to collide and not even destroy the near environment they're on? The earth should have been vaporized or at the very least the continent they're on should be gone.

trying to debunk it with science or reason is pointless its a manga

I'm simply using logic, in many cases the logic DBZ uses to measure strength (like babidi's measurement). Goku as an SS2 had power 10 times that needed to destroy a planet. That means he could destroy the planets if they were all in a nice straight line and he put everything he had into it.

Now Cell was nowhere near that level of power, so how could he destroy the solar system including the sun which is WAY bigger than a planet? It makes no sense science or not, its just logic.

How would you destroy empty space?

You missed my point, in order to destroy a solar system you would have to fill that entire solar system with energy, meaning the energy blast would have to fill all the empty space of the solar system, but still be strong enough to destroy every planet it hits AND the star of that system.

As to whether Goku could destroy planets-

Master Roshi was able to destroy the moon back in the original DB- master roshis power was about 500?
Frieza's power level at final form was more then 1 million- SS1 Goku was more then that, SS3 is much much more then that

so if you inject the maths into it, theoretically speaking Goku should be able to destroy a planet.

(Not saying that Goku could win, but explaining how it is possible for Goku to create a blast needed to destroy a planet)

Did I say he couldn't destroy a planet? No, I'm saying he never has and never will, and I'm saying he can't destroy a solar system.


To all the Goku people in here-

War Hulk has broken the laws of physics and stopped Juggernaut from moving (which is impossible in any other situation)

Laws of physics>>>>>>>>>>>>then anything Goku could do

Agreed, regular Hulk has done things Goku could never do like hold open a black hole and shatter an object twice the size of earth with a single physical blow.

Even nuclear weapons etc cannot stop Juggernaut from moving, only slow him down, as it is physically impossible in anysituation for Juggernaut to be stopped.

War Hulk stopped Juggernaut, and War Hulk can stop Goku.

Exactly, point blank nuclear weapons can't hurt the Juggernaut, but War Hulk's celestial power would have been enough to decapitate him.

[Kamendex]

You can destroy a solar system by going planet to planet and blowing them up 1 by 1


You dont need to literally destroy em all at once

[Tsukiyomi]

You can destroy a solar system by going planet to planet and blowing them up 1 by 1


You dont need to literally destroy em all at once

Them you're not destroying a SOLAR SYSTEM, you're doing exactly what I said which is only destroying one planet at a time. If thats all he is capable of then he can't destroy entire solar systems like he claims, he can merely destroy planets which can eventually accumulate into a solar system.

Hulk can destroy planets with a punch, does that mean he can destroy galaxies because he can hit each planet 1 by 1? No, you can't physically attack an entire galaxy at once and Hulk only really has physical attacks (sometimes breaking the laws of physics).

[hjkou]

The Gamma bomb is the only thing that has ever been able to hurt him to that extent and thats only because its like dropping a kryptonite powered atomic weapon on superman. And he still came back from that.

in one of the chapters featuring maestro hulk, maestro hulk was sent back in time to the atomic bomb which created hulk in the first place.. and he was owned by it, as in.. died.

and maestro hulk is supposedly the strongest incarnation~

[Gooba]

in one of the chapters featuring maestro hulk, maestro hulk was sent back in time to the atomic bomb which created hulk in the first place.. and he was owned by it, as in.. died.

and maestro hulk is supposedly the strongest incarnation~It was a gamma bomb, so you basicly just cited what he was refering to. He came back from that.

[Tsukiyomi]

in one of the chapters featuring maestro hulk, maestro hulk was sent back in time to the atomic bomb which created hulk in the first place.. and he was owned by it, as in.. died.

and maestro hulk is supposedly the strongest incarnation~

Dude, we've been talking about that for the last few pages of this thread, and Maestro came back from that. Go back a bit and reread some of the G-bomb posts.

And as Gooba said, that was the exact thing I was referring to in my post.

[Heartgobbler]

Still, is superman can fly in space by holding his breath, so should Goku.

If the Human Torch can ignite himself at will, should Goku be able to?


This power is exclusive to Human Torch. Holding breath in space seems to be just a matter of strenght so any hero who is roughly as strong as Superman should be able to do it. (Superman doesn't seem to have any special organs that would seal his breathing system. He does it just by strenght, which results from his home planet's powerful gravity, just like Goku's).

[konflikti]

This power is exclusive to Human Torch. Holding breath in space seems to be just a matter of strenght so any hero who is roughly as strong as Superman should be able to do it. (Superman doesn't seem to have any special organs that would seal his breathing system. He does it just by strenght, which results from his home planet's powerful gravity, just like Goku's). Are you joking? Goku is nowhere near the invulnerability and strength of Superman. (War) Hulk on the other hand, is.

[Othni]

In order to blow up a solar system, you don't have to blow every single planet up at the same time. All you have to do it blow up the sun and that'll cause the rest of the solar system to blow up. That's still pretty powerful even if he just ment that cause he's talking about blasting his kamehameha all the way from earth. And I don't think anyone has really blown up a star/sun. Gladiator was destroying some moon or astroid or something. If that was a star then it'd be burning and it'd look like a mini sun.

[Tsukiyomi]

In order to blow up a solar system, you don't have to blow every single planet up at the same time. All you have to do it blow up the sun and that'll cause the rest of the solar system to blow up. That's still pretty powerful even if he just ment that cause he's talking about blasting his kamehameha all the way from earth. And I don't think anyone has really blown up a star/sun. Gladiator was destroying some moon or astroid or something. If that was a star then it'd be burning and it'd look like a mini sun.

You're still only destroying one thing at a time, you didn't destroy the solar system, the sun did. If I press a button on a nuke and it annihilates a city, does that mean my finger has the power to destroy cities because my actions eventually led to that?

[tdultima]

even if cell only has the power to destroy the sun that still means he has an energy attack stronger than anything the hulk or gladiator has shown

thats what many people here are saying

gladiator punched out a planet/moon (size unknown)

hulk took out a asteroid twice the size of earth (with help from an experimental anti magnetic ect ect)

that doesnt top the sun

the question is if hulks durability and regen can survive the blast

gamma bomb > sun busting beam

or sun busting beam > gamma bomb

[Tsukiyomi]

even if cell only has the power to destroy the sun that still means he has an energy attack stronger than anything the hulk or gladiator has shown

My whole point is he probably DOESN'T have that level of power. Goku when measured by babidi as a SS2 had 10 times the power to destroy a planet, the sun is 100 times bigger than the earth.

Hulk has broken many laws of phsyics, holding open the black hole is more impressive than blowing up the sun (which cell probably can't do). A black hole can destroy pretty much anything.

thats what many people here are saying

gladiator punched out a planet/moon (size unknown)

hulk took out a asteroid twice the size of earth (with help from an experimental anti magnetic ect ect)

that doesnt top the sun

See above.

the question is if hulks durability and regen can survive the blast

gamma bomb > sun busting beam

or sun busting beam > gamma bomb

How many times do we have to say it? The gamma bomb is the specific type and frequency of energy the hulk would be most vulnerable to, you can't use its raw force as ANY type of measurement. Shoot superman with a bullet and he's, shoot him with a kryptonite bullet and he probably won't be.

[ageofdarkness]

If I'm correct, the only reason the gamma bomb had that great an effect on Maestro Hulk is because it is his specific weakness. The gamma bomb radiation explosion was what created the Hulk or something like that.

A sun destroying beam may or may not be stronger than a gamma bomb, but it is not a weakness of Hulk at all. That is why the Hulk can regenerate from it. :)

[Ssj3_Goku]

ITS WAR HULK NOT MAESTRO HULK!! WAR hulk is fighting Ssj3 goku in this so yea ..

[ageofdarkness]

Ok, you can drop 500 nuclear bombs on War Hulk. He might not even be injured, but if he is, then he will quickly regenerate to full health.

Now, you drop 1 gamma bomb on War Hulk, and well, War Hulk might come back, but it will take a while.

See, Goku needs to have some kind of ki attack that produces immense amounts of gamma radiation to have a chance of taking War Hulk out for a period of time.

Goku can have a sun destroying ki blast, but War Hulk will just regenerate.

That sun destroying ki blast could be much stronger than a gamma bomb, but will not do much to War Hulk because it is not his weakness.

[Tsukiyomi]

ITS WAR HULK NOT MAESTRO HULK!! WAR hulk is fighting Ssj3 goku in this so yea ..

War Hulk was granted almost cosmic levels of power, physically that can probably(no way to know) put him above Maestro in terms of physical durability. But since War Hulk wasn't even scratched we can't judge his durability or healing factor.

[Gooba]

They have the same weakness to the Gamma Bomb.

[Kamendex]

How would you destroy empty space?

As to whether Goku could destroy planets-

Master Roshi was able to destroy the moon back in the original DB- master roshis power was about 500?
Frieza's power level at final form was more then 1 million- SS1 Goku was more then that, SS3 is much much more then that

so if you inject the maths into it, theoretically speaking Goku should be able to destroy a planet.

(Not saying that Goku could win, but explaining how it is possible for Goku to create a blast needed to destroy a planet)

To all the Goku people in here-

War Hulk has broken the laws of physics and stopped Juggernaut from moving (which is impossible in any other situation)

Laws of physics>>>>>>>>>>>>then anything Goku could do

Even nuclear weapons etc cannot stop Juggernaut from moving, only slow him down, as it is physically impossible in anysituation for Juggernaut to be stopped.

War Hulk stopped Juggernaut, and War Hulk can stop Goku.


Kamesennin was about 140-160 power level when he destroyed then moon....and Frieza's final form was over 10 million......not 1 million...hell it was even stated that his SECOND form was over 1 million....

Also, Gokuu was measured at 3,000 Killi at SSj not SSj2....

[tdultima]

and for those that say goku cant teleport while charging a beam

remember the cell fight?

he teleported right in front of cell while charging the kamehameha and hit him point blank

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/73/Point_Blank_Kamehameha_after_Instant_Transmission. jpg

[ChaochroX]

I think people underestimate goku. I mean ever since he was fighting Vageta the first time after he got wished back he was on the level of destroying the world. The beam that Vageta shot at him was ment to destroy the world and goku shot a stronger one back at him. That was like his 3rd badguy in the whole show and he was already that strong. Its defanitly safe to say he got at least (and this is an understatement) 100x stronger then he was when he fought Vageta during the frieza saga. So at that time he had the power to destroy 100 earths with one blast. And we're talking about all the way to the end of DBZ so his power at this point is just mind bogling I doubt even the Hulk would win.

[tdultima]

Goku can have a sun destroying ki blast, but War Hulk will just regenerate.


im open to all opinions

i agree if that is the case then hulk wins

but i (personally) am not convinced that it is true

hulk has been damaged by lots of non gamma attacks...adamantium blades, gladiator beams, vector, ect.

i get the impression that a large enough non gamma attack can disintegrate hulk

whether or not he comes back from that (quickly...not 10 years) is a matter of opinion

[ageofdarkness]

im open to all opinions

i agree if that is the case then hulk wins

but i (personally) am not convinced that it is true

hulk has been damaged by lots of non gamma attacks...adamantium blades, gladiator beams, vector, ect.

i get the impression that a large enough non gamma attack can disintegrate hulk

whether or not he comes back from that (quickly...not 10 years) is a matter of opinion


Agreed and true.

War Hulk is on a celestial level many times greater than the regular Hulk. He has never been scratched before. He may or may not be stronger than Maestro Hulk physically.

Goku needs some kind of ki blast explosion that can completely wipe out War Hulk's existence, which is not possible in my opinion. :)

Some don't think Goku has this kind of destructive power or that War Hulk can regenerate from it, which is what I believe. Some think that Goku has this destructive power and that War Hulk can't regenerate from it.

I wanna ask you this question. How many punches do you think would War Hulk would need to kill Goku if Goku lets him attack freely?

[Ssj3_Goku]

^ thats the thing goku is a smart fighter so he would not let the hulk touch him.

its true war hulk can pick up an island. but can he shanke a whole earth just from powering up? goku did while going to ssj3 ( and yes its even in the manga) right their shows some danm fearsome power. Lighting bolts all around him etc.

about the nukes not stoping jugernaught. let me let you know that a a normal blast from frezia left more danamge than what a nuke can do.

[hjkou]

how about goku grabs all the dragonballs, flying around the earth while hulk chases him. then wishes hulk to be weak, MUAHA

[konflikti]

For the record, Goku may be fighting genious but he lacks the basics. Giving Cell senzu bean for example. He wants it fair. He ain't gonna make somebody weak because he wants to gauge himself against all kinds of fighters. War Hulk doesn't care about this. He just kills Goku at the very moment he is able to. It is plausible that War Hulk can shatter Earth by single punch. Can we see Goku doing that? No. What does is matter that his power up shakes the earth? I haven't seen Hulk being defeated by earthquakes and Hulk can defeat the Earth by single punch, without powering up.

Juggernaut... It's against the laws of physics to stop him(have we seen DBZ people bend or break the law of their respective worlds physics?). Yet War Hulk did it. And didn't even seem like much of a feat to him.

Yeah, Hulk has been damaged by lot of stuff. But they barely slow him down. And we are talking about War Hulk. He hasn't been even scratched. How can you tell that with his mighty sword(Absorbing Man tried to absorb it, and exploded) he couldn't hit Goku's big beam right back at him? But well, there is no proof of that. So pro Hulk cannot really use that as advantage.

The thing with DBZ beam-attacks is that they are supposed to be all-mighty planetary destruction forces, yet they do virtually no damage to anything. Goku and the crew are _supposed_ to be able to destroy planets by single attack yet they never do. They barely break the ground. So something is very wrong.

[braindx]

and for those that say goku cant teleport while charging a beam

remember the cell fight?

he teleported right in front of cell while charging the kamehameha and hit him point blank

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/73/Point_Blank_Kamehameha_after_Instant_Transmission. jpg

NO ONE SAID THAT. I said that he didn't use IT when he was holding the Genki Dama when Buu threw an energy ball at him when you said he did use IT. And I provided you with the manga page to back up my statement.


how about goku grabs all the dragonballs, flying around the earth while hulk chases him. then wishes hulk to be weak, MUAHA

No. I'll leave you to figure out why.. :)


The thing with DBZ beam-attacks is that they are supposed to be all-mighty planetary destruction forces, yet they do virtually no damage to anything. Goku and the crew are _supposed_ to be able to destroy planets by single attack yet they never do. They barely break the ground. So something is very wrong.

Well, all of the planetary destroying attacks we saw in DB (Buu destroying earth and Frieza destroying Namek) were from energy balls fired at the core of the earth. Eh, I don't really know if that means anything or not though :P

[konflikti]

Well, all of the planetary destroying attacks we saw in DB (Buu destroying earth and Frieza destroying Namek) were from energy balls fired at the core of the earth. Eh, I don't really know if that means anything or not though :P
Yeah, I know. The point is that most pro-Goku people try to point out that every single Kamehameha from Goku would destroy at least planets. Yet there are only couple instances where the attack was especially aimed for planet and it did destroy the planet. The beams that they shoot at each other usually seem to do some minor damage compared to the size of planets.

[hjkou]

No. I'll leave you to figure out why.. :)

cbf, tell me please

unless its "hulk punched a hole in reality, and altered the universe so that the db's were never made".. if thats the case i dont want to hear it

[konflikti]

Dragon Balls are out-side help. Do we give Hulk the chance to borrow SS's board?

[Pinkaugust]

Hej hjkou, I think you had a really good point there, Goku can just Wish Hulk never existed if he want's to, also, he could blow up the planet with hulk on it, and right at the impact moment, teleport away to another planet, and survive, whilst Hulk either freezes to death (-276 degrees is the coldest there is, and therefor hulk dies) suffocate, If hulk can run out of breath which he can (even if it makes him grow stronger, so he gains more power to keep fighting when tired) or he could leave him there forever until he just dies, he can't go anywhere anyways.. A win for Goku, simple..

[konflikti]

Except Hulk doesn't die of old age, unlike Goku. Except Hulk can survive in space, unlike Goku. Except teleporting to another planet would be running away(not win, duh). Except he needs a ki source where to lock too(outside help). And except Goku has never displayed the ability destroy a planet, even if it is highly possible. It's also possible for Hulk to maneuver in space by taking his finger off and throwing it in some direction to gain momentum and then regrowing that finger. After a while we have lightspeed travelling War Hulk who is seriously pissed off.

Oh, and DBs are outside help. They do not count.

[hjkou]

war hulk wouldnt be able to take his own finger off
hes skin and body is just, to invulnerable i thought : )

[Pinkaugust]

Except Hulk doesn't die of old age, unlike Goku. Except Hulk can survive in space, unlike Goku. Except teleporting to another planet would be running away(not win, duh). Except he needs a ki source where to lock too(outside help). And except Goku has never displayed the ability destroy a planet, even if it is highly possible. It's also possible for Hulk to maneuver in space by taking his finger off and throwing it in some direction to gain momentum and then regrowing that finger. After a while we have lightspeed travelling War Hulk who is seriously pissed off.

Oh, and DBs are outside help. They do not count.
Hulk cannot move in space, noone can, and that's just a rediculous statement from you. Throwing away his finger? lol Truly you must be stupid.
I don't consider that running away as the hulk would already be beaten when he teleports away. And there are Ki sources everywhere.
Why does it matter so much to you whether goku uses the dragonballs or he destroys a planet? Gokus power is beyond destroying galaxies by now, so he could destroy hulk anyway, but destroying a planet then wishing it back, would be the best victory, because Hulk gets trapped in space anyhow, if he survived the explosion, which could totally destroy him. Remember that Goku has faced similar foes in Cell and Buu, and therefor knows how to beat regenerating cells, and also Cell and Buu knew how to deflect his attacks Hulk doesn't and therefor is open to any attack of Son Gokus choosing. Hulk isn't invincible, no matter what you say.

[konflikti]

Hulk cannot move in space, noone can, and that's just a rediculous statement from you. Throwing away his finger? lol Truly you must be stupid.
Well, how did humankind reach Moon, huh? Anyways, that ridiculous statement is also called sarcasm. Meaning that I wasn't serious, and was just joking around, in case you didn't know.

Why does it matter so much to you whether goku uses the dragonballs or he destroys a planet?
Destroying the planet Hulk stands on is no win for Goku. Hulk can do that too and that doesn't mean he just won Goku. Dragon Balls is outside help, so of course it matters. Goku usually isn't equipped with DB you know. Just like War Hulk doesn't come equipped with Surfers board and Infinity Gauntlet.

Gokus power is beyond destroying galaxies by now, so he could destroy hulk anyway, but destroying a planet then wishing it back, would be the best victory, because Hulk gets trapped in space anyhow, if he survived the explosion, which could totally destroy him.
Space doesn't kill him. Have we seen Goku destroy galaxies? No, so therefore he ain't able to do that. You can argue that he should be able to destroy maybe planets or solar systems with his energy blasts, yet they rarely show such a power. Hulk on the other hand has destroyed meteor twice the size of Earth by single punch.

Remember that Goku has faced similar foes in Cell and Buu, and therefor knows how to beat regenerating cells, and also Cell and Buu knew how to deflect his attacks Hulk doesn't and therefor is open to any attack of Son Gokus choosing. Hulk isn't invincible, no matter what you say.
Hulk probably has faced flying and energy blasting foes before too. Does that mean that he automatically wins? Hulk has enough physical power to break laws of physics. Why wouldn't he be able to push some puny ki-blast aside?

Hulk isn't invincible, but he is damn near invulnerable and regenerates damn fast.

[Pinkaugust]

Well, how did humankind reach Moon, huh? Anyways, that ridiculous statement is also called sarcasm. Meaning that I wasn't serious, and was just joking around, in case you didn't know.

Whatever, then.. That's out of the world.

Destroying the planet Hulk stands on is no win for Goku. Hulk can do that too and that doesn't mean he just won Goku. Dragon Balls is outside help, so of course it matters. Goku usually isn't equipped with DB you know. Just like War Hulk doesn't come equipped with Surfers board and Infinity Gauntlet.

True..

Space doesn't kill him. Have we seen Goku destroy galaxies? No, so therefore he ain't able to do that. You can argue that he should be able to destroy maybe planets or solar systems with his energy blasts, yet they rarely show such a power. Hulk on the other hand has destroyed meteor twice the size of Earth by single punch.

Goku destroyed Brolli who holds the power to destroy galaxies, and Buu is the ultimate weapon, and he can easilly destroy entire galaxies, too.. If Goku can destroy then, and then also grow stronger, he should already have surpassed them. Don't you agree?

Hulk probably has faced flying and energy blasting foes before too. Does that mean that he automatically wins? Hulk has enough physical power to break laws of physics. Why wouldn't he be able to push some puny ki-blast aside?

He wins, period.

[Shiron]

Goku destroyed Brolli who holds the power to destroy galaxies, and Buu is the ultimate weapon, and he can easilly destroy entire galaxies, too.. If Goku can destroy then, and then also grow stronger, he should already have surpassed them. Don't you agree?



He wins, period.
Brolly = DBZ movie = non-cannon = Doesn't count.
When has Buu destroyed an entire galaxy in one attack? I remember him destroying one planet at a time with his energy blasts, but not an entire galaxy.
Goku by himself didn't beat Buu. He used a Genki Dama, filled with the energy from across the whole universe, to finish off Buu. A Genki Dama. While that's Goku's technique, it's filled with the energy of people across the universe. And yet again, Hulk wouldn't just sit there and let Goku charge it. Goku might be able to take successive attacks from Freiza and Buu, but there's no way he can take too many direct blows from the War Hulk while attempting to charge the attack that even if he did finish it, it probably wouldn't kill the Hulk anyways. -MnK

[tdultima]

NO ONE SAID THAT. I said that he didn't use IT when he was holding the Genki Dama when Buu threw an energy ball at him when you said he did use IT. And I provided you with the manga page to back up my statement.


a lot of people said goku wouldnt have time to charge up a beam so im proving that goku can in fact teleport while charging


anyway heres what you said

"Okay, Volume 42, Chap 14, Pic 2... His body blurs on the bottom middle panel to dodge Buu's blast... but it CAN'T be instant transmission (IT) because there is no one around him to lock his Ki onto AND he stays in virtually the same place he was up in the air before Buu fired the blast. Additionally, he doesn't have the ability to touch his forehead and focus which we've seen he must do each and every time he wants to IT. He HAS to have just sidestepped it quickly."


1. he can lock on to the genki dama's ki

2. we've seen goku stay in the same place and teleport before...remember when he demonstrated the IT to trunks the first time and showed him roshi's sunglasses?

3. touching the forhead is not required as we can see in the cell battle


so how are you so sure that it wasn't IT?

[Ssj3_Goku]

For the record, Goku may be fighting genious but he lacks the basics. Giving Cell senzu bean for example. He wants it fair. He ain't gonna make somebody weak because he wants to gauge himself against all kinds of fighters. War Hulk doesn't care about this. He just kills Goku at the very moment he is able to. It is plausible that War Hulk can shatter Earth by single punch. Can we see Goku doing that? No. What does is matter that his power up shakes the earth? I haven't seen Hulk being defeated by earthquakes and Hulk can defeat the Earth by single punch, without powering up.

Juggernaut... It's against the laws of physics to stop him(have we seen DBZ people bend or break the law of their respective worlds physics?). Yet War Hulk did it. And didn't even seem like much of a feat to him.

Yeah, Hulk has been damaged by lot of stuff. But they barely slow him down. And we are talking about War Hulk. He hasn't been even scratched. How can you tell that with his mighty sword(Absorbing Man tried to absorb it, and exploded) he couldn't hit Goku's big beam right back at him? But well, there is no proof of that. So pro Hulk cannot really use that as advantage.

The thing with DBZ beam-attacks is that they are supposed to be all-mighty planetary destruction forces, yet they do virtually no damage to anything. Goku and the crew are _supposed_ to be able to destroy planets by single attack yet they never do. They barely break the ground. So something is very wrong.


yes in DBZ we did see the law of physic's broken when Buu and Gotenks ( in ssj3) can rip threw time and space .. Buu would have succed in breaking the whole physical cosmo's if vegeto did not stop him so yes we did see that stuff in DBZ.

I am just saying the fear force of the power goku has if u can make the whole earth shake just from calling forth power that is pretty danm insane and the fact of having lightingbolts around him and what not basically meaning is one tough power hose.

plus about the attacks u tend to forget they control them beams if they want they can destroy the planent if not they have the power to divert it or not ppl tend to forget that.


plus kon war hulk does not have silvers surfer board that is monstrous hulk or whatever so dont get them mixed up in ur facts.


men goku got the spirit bombs power to beat buu from every life on the earth not the universe.

plus about all these nukes not scratching war hulk over half of frezia's attacks on super sayien goku the explosions where alot bigger than a nuke and goku stood their unarmed with a grin on his face. So yea goku cna take blast's like a nuke and still not get hurt.


plus kon about the did we see goku destroy a galaxy no we have not but it was stated by cell ( anime and manga) that he had enough power to destroy a the entire soloar system and he was only in ssj2 form. So yes goku does have that power.

[konflikti]

plus about the attacks u tend to forget they control them beams if they want they can destroy the planent if not they have the power to divert it or not ppl tend to forget that.Wouldn't they want to hit their enemies with everything they got? Maybe it's just plot induced stupidity though. It would be kinda ridiculous to see Goku accidently blow up the planet he was on and die in space.

plus kon war hulk does not have silvers surfer board that is monstrous hulk or whatever so dont get them mixed up in ur facts.
Please don't school me for something I didn't say. I just compared Goku having Dragon Balls around to that. And the particular Hulk is Maestro. Not that he'd be able to ride that thing anyway.


plus about all these nukes not scratching war hulk over half of frezia's attacks on super sayien goku the explosions where alot bigger than a nuke and goku stood their unarmed with a grin on his face. So yea goku cna take blast's like a nuke and still not get hurt.
Yet they were not nuke. As far as I know, Goku doesn't have resistance to extremely high temperatures, which is what nukes are all about. You can't compare ki-blasts and nukes directly.

plus kon about the did we see goku destroy a galaxy no we have not but it was stated by cell ( anime and manga) that he had enough power to destroy a the entire soloar system and he was only in ssj2 form. So yes goku does have that power.
Even if that was true, and not just Cell bullshitting, solar system is only a tiny tiny fraction of a galaxy. It would take long time for Goku to destroy whole galaxy even if he had the power to disingterate a solar system by single blast and could survive in space.

[Kamendex]

yes in DBZ we did see the law of physic's broken when Buu and Gotenks ( in ssj3) can rip threw time and space .. Buu would have succed in breaking the whole physical cosmo's if vegeto did not stop him so yes we did see that stuff in DBZ.


Filler....you use too much filler buddy....



2. we've seen goku stay in the same place and teleport before...remember when he demonstrated the IT to trunks the first time and showed him roshi's sunglasses?



Dude are you serious.....? Gokuu ITED to Kamesennin and back....why the hell do you think he was wearing his glasses? That's not staying in the same place and teleporting...

[tdultima]

Dude are you serious.....? Gokuu ITED to Kamesennin and back....why the hell do you think he was wearing his glasses? That's not staying in the same place and teleporting...

why is it so hard to believe that goku can IT away to avoid buu's attack?

i meant he ITed away and and ITed back to reappeared in the same place

at first vegata said it was a speed trick...then the sunglasses were proof

so goku ITed away from buu's attack and reappeared to continue with the genki dama

thats what i meant

[Kamendex]

why is it so hard to believe that goku can IT away to avoid buu's attack?

i meant he ITed away and and ITed back to reappeared in the same place

at first vegata said it was a speed trick...then the sunglasses were proof

so goku ITed away from buu's attack and reappeared to continue with the genki dama

thats what i meant

Except he'd needed someone to IT to which we dont know if he did....but we do know when he came back he didnt IT to ANYONE cause there was no one near him....Gokuu side-stepped/warped.......

It's not the same thing he did when he went to get Kamesennin's glasses...

[braindx]

a lot of people said goku wouldnt have time to charge up a beam so im proving that goku can in fact teleport while charging


anyway heres what you said

"Okay, Volume 42, Chap 14, Pic 2... His body blurs on the bottom middle panel to dodge Buu's blast... but it CAN'T be instant transmission (IT) because there is no one around him to lock his Ki onto AND he stays in virtually the same place he was up in the air before Buu fired the blast. Additionally, he doesn't have the ability to touch his forehead and focus which we've seen he must do each and every time he wants to IT. He HAS to have just sidestepped it quickly."


1. he can lock on to the genki dama's ki

2. we've seen goku stay in the same place and teleport before...remember when he demonstrated the IT to trunks the first time and showed him roshi's sunglasses?

3. touching the forhead is not required as we can see in the cell battle


so how are you so sure that it wasn't IT?

You are absolutely wrong. Goku cannot have used IT when he was holding the Genki Dama because if he did there was no Ki to lock onto to go back to the same place in the air that he was previously. Therefore, that means he must have sidestepped it.


And for all of you excitedly yapping about using the dragonballs... No, Goku can't wish the Hulk powered down or dead because that is not the in scope of the dragon's power. For example. Krillen wished for Android 18 to become human but the dragon said he wasn't able to make the wish come true for people stronger than he is. Specifically shenron says "I can't do that. Both cyborgs are much stronger than me so I can't do anything to their persons." (Vol35, Ch10, Pg2, bottom right panel). The Z team also wished to make someone weak.. I can't remember who exactly (but it was during the Cell/Buu saga), but the dragon couldn't do it either. So stop bring up the dragonballs.