Kisame prime vs Itachi prime

[Jαmes]

No holds barred contest. Both are intent to kill the other. Both have 100% chakra. Both are in prime condition. Let your imagination fly.

[Purble Place]

Does Kisame know about Itachis abilities?? (In this match up)

[MikageHanashi]

I'll have Kisame since he contains greater chakra than Itachi and possesses that freaky sword. Dba it can cut off chakra whatever? And, he'll definitely drown Itachi..

[Para]

It'd be a difficult matchup that'll probably never happen, but I've got to give this to Itachi.

[Beliz]

Itachi would out smart the beast. Kisame would go all out with some crazy ninjutsu's but Itachi has Amaterasu if he wanted to get physical which could destroy anything and Genjutsu/Tsukuyumi or however you spell it.

Itachi has this.

[eDyH]

Kisame Prime drowns continents for breakfast.

[Sōsuke Aizen]

itachi will always own kisame.

[Watchman]

IN b4 Kisametards/GBtards :awesome

Kisame, being the arrogant bastard he is, looks into Itachi's eyes. Itachi uses Mangekyou Sharingan. Kisame dies/goes into coma. Fight over.

[eDyH]

IN b4 Kisametards/GBtards :awesome

Kisame, being the arrogant bastard he is, looks into Itachi's eyes. Itachi uses Mangekyou Sharingan. Kisame dies/goes into coma. Fight over.

Quit being so biased. :LOS

You obviously haven't the slightest grasp of how powerful Kisame Prime truly is.

[Topher]

are people this blind?! it's pretty obvious itachi owns kisame.

[Teach]

Kisame wins by distant. :pek

[Zapdos]

Itachi will pwn Kisame prime or not.

[Cirus]

Since no one has yet to vote for it. I say it will be a tie.........

[sworder]

Itachi wins. One genjutsu is all it takes for Itachi to slit his throat.

[Cochise]

Kisame winz

[TreeofSephri]

A great ninja is not his insane chakra capacity, super strength, or aquatic weaponry; it is the ability to decieve that truly makes a great ninja. Itachi has proved time and time again that he is a master of deception, the art that is the great equalizer in the ninja world, and has also shown mastery in all facets of shinobidom. Ask yourself, how effective is Kisame's berserker strategies against someone who outsmarted Kakashi, a true genius. Once again ask yourself, how will Kisame use those monstrous suiton jutsu when Itachi's seal speed far surpasses his own? What good is super strength when your target could be an exploding bunshin? How effectively can one fight when a moment's folly can result in being trapped in a spirit breaking genjutsu? I will admit that Kisame is truly a fearsome opponent ;however, Itachi ,in my mind, has shown himself to be a fearsome amalgamation of both brains and brawn ,which makes him superior to Kisame.

[Distracted]

I'm hoping everyone keeps it clean in here and stays open to discussion.

In my opinion, I think Itachi is clearly the superior opponent here. I don't understand what you mean by 'prime' as the 2 are currently IN their prime and Itachi is the one giving the orders.

[eDyH]

I'm hoping everyone keeps it clean in here and stays open to discussion.

:dupe

In my opinion, I think Itachi is clearly the superior opponent here. I don't understand what you mean by 'prime' as the 2 are currently IN their prime and Itachi is the one giving the orders.

I don't think Itachi has reached his prime just yet....

Is he even 20?

[Euraj]

Please. It looks like Kisame even fell for Kurenai's Genjutsu. There's no way he can beat Itachi's.

[Kieuseru]

Itachi wins. He is superior to Kisame.

[Nae'blis]

^Distracted: I'm not sure what you mean Distracted, they get orders from Pein but not from each other. And giving orders is not indicative of strength, unless we are willing to believe that Shikamaru was stronger than Neji/Naruto/Kiba/Chouji during the initial Rescue Sasuke arc. I doubt that he was. I don't see it as orders, the interaction between the two of them. Itachi might have an advantage with speed, but Kisame is able to keep up with Gai (basically making that advantage unworthy of mention). Kisame will overpower Itachi, they only question being what will Kisame do against Mangekyou Sharingan Tsukiyomi. If Deidara, who wasn't even exposed to Itachi, was able to at least draw up plans for a sharingan defense/counter, than Kisame who is exposed to Itachi should also at least have an idea how to negate sharingan genjutsu including Tsukiyomi.

[Shodai]

I'm hoping everyone keeps it clean in here and stays open to discussion.

In my opinion, I think Itachi is clearly the superior opponent here. I don't understand what you mean by 'prime' as the 2 are currently IN their prime and Itachi is the one giving the orders.

Kisame can erase a continent at 100%

Itachi can erase a wall with his sharingan's best jutsu, and makes him go blind


Kisame wins

[Distracted]

^Distracted: I'm not sure what you mean Distracted, they get orders from Pein but not from each other. And giving orders is not indicative of strength, unless we are willing to believe that Shikamaru was stronger than Neji/Naruto/Kiba/Chouji during the initial Rescue Sasuke arc. I doubt that he was. I don't see it as orders, the interaction between the two of them. Itachi might have an advantage with speed, but Kisame is able to keep up with Gai (basically making that advantage unworthy of mention). Kisame will overpower Itachi, they only question being what will Kisame do against Mangekyou Sharingan Tsukiyomi. If Deidara, who wasn't even exposed to Itachi, was able to at least draw up plans for a sharingan defense/counter, than Kisame who is exposed to Itachi should also at least have an idea how to negate sharingan genjutsu including Tsukiyomi.

Look at the way they interact during any battle. Kisame takes orders from Itachi. Add in the way Itachi acted during his fight against the Konoha jonin and it seems that Itachi was the one doing most of the work oddly enough.

Plus Kisame stated that he would be defeated by Jiraya, but expressed doubt that Itachi would be defeated by him. That implies that Kisame felt he was inferior to Itachi and Jiraiya.

Kisame can erase a continent at 100%

Itachi can erase a wall with his sharingan's best jutsu, and makes him go blind


Kisame wins

Please keep GB 1 liners out of a section devoted to discussion of match ups.

[Jαmes]

Does Kisame know about Itachis abilities?? (In this match up)

It's no holds barred so they know each other's abilities...

[wyat_erp]

Kisame will win coz he has the biggest chakra capacity... hehe... he rockz!

[Perestroika]

I'll give it to Kisame that he'd know how to counter a lot of Itachi's jutsu, and wouldn't be stupid enough to make eye-contact with him, but how will Kisame counter Ameterasu?
It doesn't require eye-contact because Itachi used it on an inanimate object.

It would be a difficult fight, but Itachi would win. He's not even in his prime yet(he's 21 in the manga) and it's already implied he's the more powerful one of the pair.

[King Scoop]

Itachi wins. Kisame already admitted that Itachi was stronger.

[Elite Uchiha]

Kisame would be mind raped by Itachi, Itachi wins without moving

[Psycho Master]

Kisame would be mind raped by Itachi, Itachi wins without moving

Even though you're an Uchihatard, I'm going to have to agree with you and say Itachi is above Kisame's level. Itachi may have to move a bit in the fight, but it will mostly be mind rape on Kisame.

[Cthulhu-versailles]

Itachi Prime====
Itachi fires Amaretsu from his eyeballs and vaporizes Kisame.
or
Itachi uses the technique I speculate is his final MS technique.
Is that imaginative enough ?

In all seriousness, Kisame stands no chance of escpaing itachi's higher end genjutsu. Itachi wins even though Kisame thinks he did.

[Cf24699]

the uchiha is just too fast and versitile for kisame

[Purble Place]

If we consider what the manga tells us then Itachi would win, however if we dont consider the manga, and just base this on what we've seen till now (from both characters) in my humble opinion kisame would win. with a 100% chakra he would just maintain a safe distance from Itachi and flood the entire place send sharks towards Itachi plus kisames swimming skills >>> Itachi, and he has the samehada he could also use this advantage greatly, all kisame has to do is not look into itachi's eys, and flooding a place does not require tha., yup, i'm pretty sure kisame would take this.

[Jαmes]

Kisame doesn't have to look into Itachi's eyes to fight him. And for all we know, the shark man can move faster than the uchiha. And he can send tidal wave after tidal wave at Itachi without really being anywhere near.

[Psycho Master]

Kisame doesn't have to look into Itachi's eyes to fight him. And for all we know, the shark man can move faster than the uchiha. And he can send tidal wave after tidal wave at Itachi without really being anywhere near.

Yes, but we also know that Itachi can use fairly high level genjutsu just by pointing his fingers. Kisame may escape one or two of them, but he won't be able to escape Itachi's more powerful genjutsu.

[brawler]

Since no one has yet to vote for it. I say it will be a tie.........


I voted for tie too. They seem equal to me. Both have disadvantages and advantages. And they know each other's abilities. So i'd say draw too.

[Grimmjowsensei]

Itachi is Kisame's pimp. Clever ones will figure out the rest.

[Sustainz]

Kisame is the ones giving the orders. By genjutsuing Itachi. He thinks he gives the orders. :pek

And who cares who orders? Generals lead soldiers. Soldiers > Generals in battle.

[Nae'blis]

Look at the way they interact during any battle. Kisame takes orders from Itachi. Add in the way Itachi acted during his fight against the Konoha jonin and it seems that Itachi was the one doing most of the work oddly enough.

Plus Kisame stated that he would be defeated by Jiraya, but expressed doubt that Itachi would be defeated by him. That implies that Kisame felt he was inferior to Itachi and Jiraiya.
Yes, and thats what I said was irrelevant. Asking Kisame to do something doesn't mean he is the stronger one. Why would Kisame argue with Itachi when Itachi knows whats going on? I'm not trying to build an argument saying that Kisame is smarter than itachi, which is the only thing taking orders from Itachi would mean. I'm saying he is stronger.

Itachi wasn't doing all of the work, Kisame was fighting Asuma and Itachi was fighting Kurenai. When Kakashi arrived, the fight from that point was only to show that Itachi was better than Kakashi with the sharingan. That also doesn't mean anything when comparing their strengths. We might as well say Hidan is stronger than Kakuzu because he wanted to fight the four Niju Shotai by himself.

As to what Kisame said, that might as well be filler. Kisame was talking about the Sannin being strong. He said something to the effect of "that man is a Sannin, he would be a match for you and I together". Thats obviously wrong. We've known since forever that Orochimaru is stronger than Jiraiya, yet Itachi swept Orochimaru aside like a child. How can anyone believe that Jiraiya is so superior to Orochimaru that Itachi would lose to Jiraiya?

Itachi said during his Konoha battle that "only a sharingan user with the same kekkei genkai as me can defeat me". But that would mean he is lying since he is taking orders from Pein (according to the "taking orders" argument). Spoken words mean nothing.

* I call shenanigans on that battle too since no Jounin with any sense would perform a genin level genjutsu on a sharingan user. If genjutsu is an intellectual ninjutsu, why would Kurenai be stupid enough to try it against a genjutsu eye?


Itachi wins. Kisame already admitted that Itachi was stronger.Yeah, that means nothing. Shikamaru knows Asume is stronger than himself, that didn't stop Shikamaru defeating Hidan. Including the idea that maybe Kisame's style of "flood the world with a tsunami" wasn't suited to what they were doing.

If we consider what the manga tells us then Itachi would win, however if we dont consider the manga, and just base this on what we've seen till now (from both characters) in my humble opinion kisame would win. with a 100% chakra he would just maintain a safe distance from Itachi and flood the entire place send sharks towards Itachi plus kisames swimming skills >>> Itachi, and he has the samehada he could also use this advantage greatly, all kisame has to do is not look into itachi's eys, and flooding a place does not require tha., yup, i'm pretty sure kisame would take this.I'm starting to think that Kishimoto is confused.

[vagnard]

There is an argument yet?. Itachi himself recognize Itachi's strength above of his own when he believes he has no chance against Jiraiya but Itachi could take him down.

Itachi gives orders and Kisame follows him.

Kisame treats Itachi as his senior just like Deidara treated Sasori. Get it over.

Itachi-SAN wins

Sorry I like Kisame more than Itachi. But the reality is Itachi is the third strongest member of Akatsuki after Pain and Madara.

[Munboy Dracule O'Brian]

Kisame would give Itachi a fight, but Itachi would win, unless Kisame shows something that can help him against Itachi

[Nae'blis]

There is an argument yet?. Itachi himself recognize Itachi's strength above of his own when he believes he has no chance against Jiraiya but Itachi could take him down.

Itachi gives orders and Kisame follows him.

Kisame treats Itachi as his senior just like Deidara treated Sasori. Get it over.

Itachi-SAN wins

Sorry I like Kisame more than Itachi. But the reality is Itachi is the third strongest member of Akatsuki after Pain and Madara.
So because Itachi called Kurenai/Kakashi/Asuma "name"-san, then he is inferior to them? Kisame's way of speaking to Itachi is as irrelevant as him following the suggestions Itachi makes. Disregarding whatever nonsense Kishi puts in his characters mouths, from what we have seen from them it is obvious Kisame is at the least equal if not stronger than Itachi.

Is the battledome about what is said, or about knowing the abilities of the respective parties involved? Doesn't battledome remove all CIS/PIS/DEM/KFW from battle scenarios? I'm not normally in this subforum, so I need this explained to me.

[Munboy Dracule O'Brian]

So because Itachi called Kurenai/Kakashi/Asuma "name"-san, then he is inferior to them? Kisame's way of speaking to Itachi is as irrelevant as him following the suggestions Itachi makes. Disregarding whatever nonsense Kishi puts in his characters mouths, from what we have seen from them it is obvious Kisame is at the least equal if not stronger than Itachi.

Is the battledome about what is said, or about knowing the abilities of the respective parties involved? Doesn't battledome remove all CIS/PIS/DEM/KFW from battle scenarios? I'm not normally in this subforum, so I need this explained to me.

OK what is

CIS, PIS, DEM and KFW

[Nae'blis]

Character Induced Stupidity
Plot Induced Stupidity
Deus Ex Machina
Kishimoto Fan Wanking

[KUKU_nr8]

Itachi wins this, he is too fast for Kisame, and smarter than him.

[Yamato]

Kisame prime is an overkill.

30% of normal current Kisame can easily kill Itachi Prime.

The problem is that Kisame needs to catch Itachi, we know how fast he is running.

If Kisame catches him, Kisame wins.

[Topher]

So because Itachi called Kurenai/Kakashi/Asuma "name"-san, then he is inferior to them? Kisame's way of speaking to Itachi is as irrelevant as him following the suggestions Itachi makes. Disregarding whatever nonsense Kishi puts in his characters mouths, from what we have seen from them it is obvious Kisame is at the least equal if not stronger than Itachi.

Is the battledome about what is said, or about knowing the abilities of the respective parties involved? Doesn't battledome remove all CIS/PIS/DEM/KFW from battle scenarios? I'm not normally in this subforum, so I need this explained to me.

if kisame can take on itachi, why did he doupt his abilities to face jiraiya but had confidence in itachi?

he knows he is inferior to itachi, even in recent chapters he is carrying out itachi's bidding.

furthermore we have already seen itachi using suiton ninjutsu which means he can easily copy whatever kisame is dishing out at him. but i doubt it would even amount to that since he would get genjutsu raped even before the battle begun.

its very clear who the superior shinobi is, only haters will believe kisame can hold his own against itachi.

kisame is bijuu level, but the bijuu's are the uchiha's pets.

[Nae'blis]

I've addressed most of those issues you raise in previous posts in this thread. As for the Suiton ninjutsu, I doubt Itachi will be able to bukkake an entire ocean by himself, nor does he have the monstrous chakra to perform the jutsu Kisame would be using. Being able to see the handseals =/= replicating the jutsu. Itachi will be screwed once Kisame touches him with Samehada, chakra gone and everything. I know someone will say "but Kisame won;t touch Itachi", and to that I'll say that Kisame could and will. Itachi kicking around some random n00bs doesn't mean anything when Kisame was able to keep up with Gai.

Genjutsu raped by Itachi? Doubtful.

It's very clear to me that anyone who says "zomg wtf Itachi owns easily" is ignoring the evidence of what has actually happened. What people say is hardly ever what actually happens. Remember when Kankurou said "No one has ever touched Gaara"? You remember that? Do you also remember what happened shortly afterwards? Gaara got his ass kicked around by a bunch of fucking genins. No one will then say that Genins > Gaara > Sunagakure Jounins, because that is obvious BS. Spoken words can not be used to build a case when it is something like character hyping.

Uchiha's might be friends with Kyubi, but Kisame is above Biju level since his 30% chakra is more than that of Kyubi.

[Cf24699]

itachi will take some damage but in the end is too fast and versitile for kisame. Plus ms does make this difficult for kisame to even fight on and even level.

[NarutoWinsByDefault]

I cant see Itachi just taking a little dmg, its a hit or miss, either Kisame gets him or he dont, I believe due to the intensity of his chakra and just overall power shown, he has to know all itachi's moves by now.. I mean Itachi can automatically see/predict all of Kisame's from sharingan..but it dont mean anything if he is too messed up to swim.

[Topher]

I've addressed most of those issues you raise in previous posts in this thread. As for the Suiton ninjutsu, I doubt Itachi will be able to bukkake an entire ocean by himself, nor does he have the monstrous chakra to perform the jutsu Kisame would be using. Being able to see the handseals =/= replicating the jutsu. Itachi will be screwed once Kisame touches him with Samehada, chakra gone and everything. I know someone will say "but Kisame won;t touch Itachi", and to that I'll say that Kisame could and will. Itachi kicking around some random n00bs doesn't mean anything when Kisame was able to keep up with Gai.

Genjutsu raped by Itachi? Doubtful.

It's very clear to me that anyone who says "zomg wtf Itachi owns easily" is ignoring the evidence of what has actually happened. What people say is hardly ever what actually happens. Remember when Kankurou said "No one has ever touched Gaara"? You remember that? Do you also remember what happened shortly afterwards? Gaara got his ass kicked around by a bunch of fucking genins. No one will then say that Genins > Gaara > Sunagakure Jounins, because that is obvious BS. Spoken words can not be used to build a case when it is something like character hyping.

Uchiha's might be friends with Kyubi, but Kisame is above Biju level since his 30% chakra is more than that of Kyubi.

you haven't explained anything in your previous post. all i've read were weak arguments trying to upgrade kisame.

when team gaara was introduced, it was obvious gaara was the strongest and its the same case here.

you haven't explained why kisame stated he couldn't take on jiraiya, but believed itachi could. kisame himself sees itachi as his superior in combat, but you say otherwise.

manga evidence>>> your argument.


oh and the samehada does not suck up chakra the way you drew it up.
the samehada touching someone will not absorb chakra unless there is chakra being leaked out.

kisame faced of against asuma, shaved kisame's shoulder, and it did not go as easy as you are posting it.

[Kieuseru]

I've addressed most of those issues you raise in previous posts in this thread. As for the Suiton ninjutsu, I doubt Itachi will be able to bukkake an entire ocean by himself, nor does he have the monstrous chakra to perform the jutsu Kisame would be using. Being able to see the handseals =/= replicating the jutsu. Itachi will be screwed once Kisame touches him with Samehada, chakra gone and everything. I know someone will say "but Kisame won;t touch Itachi", and to that I'll say that Kisame could and will. Itachi kicking around some random n00bs doesn't mean anything when Kisame was able to keep up with Gai.
Kisame hit Asuma with the Samehada, but Asuma was using chakra later.

Genjutsu raped by Itachi? Doubtful.

How is it doubtful? Oro was caught in Itachi's genjutsu, and Kisame was caught in Kurenias genjutsu.
It's very clear to me that anyone who says "zomg wtf Itachi owns easily" is ignoring the evidence of what has actually happened. What people say is hardly ever what actually happens. Remember when Kankurou said "No one has ever touched Gaara"? You remember that? Do you also remember what happened shortly afterwards? Gaara got his ass kicked around by a bunch of fucking genins. No one will then say that Genins > Gaara > Sunagakure Jounins, because that is obvious BS. Spoken words can not be used to build a case when it is something like character hyping.

Has is past tense meaning that no ever touched him before, not that no one will touch him. That is fact in the manga whether it's logical or not. Kisame said that he might not be able to defeat an opponent but Itachi can. That means that Kisame is weaker than Itachi, your argument would only be reasonable if Kisame wasn't the one that said it.

[Nae'blis]

^ lol, here I was thinking you wanted to post reasonably and get to the bottom of this. *sigh* my arguments are weak simply because you are too simple minded to read one sentence after another. I already posted why Kisame said that about Jiraiya.

manga evidence contradicts manga evidence, my argument is based on the manga.

What was so obvious about Gaara when he was introduced that made it clear he was the strongest? Was it when he talked down to Kankurou? Well, Sasuke talked down to Lee and still got his ass kicked. Was it when Kankurou obeyed Gaara's order? Well, giving orders =/= strength. Or was it when Kankurou started shitting himself after Gaara spoke? Yes, this is what it was that made it clear, and I haven't seen Kisame shit himself in fear of Itachi.

And what exactly is "chakra being leaked out"? People can't release chakra from all over their bodies, only Hyuuga and KN. Unless you mean that Samehada only works on Hyuuga and Naruto, I don't see what your point was.

I made no reference to Kisame fighting Asuma, I concentrated on Itachi's role in that battle. And from your post, I gather you want me to believe that Asuma gave 100% Kisame a challenge? And that Asuma > 6 Gates Gai?

If you have nothing to add to this besides "you fail, etc" don't even bother responding.

[sworder]

Itachi kicking around some random n00bs doesn't mean anything when Kisame was able to keep up with Gai.

Yeah... Orochimaru, Deidara, and Kakashi are noobs.

Uchiha's might be friends with Kyubi, but Kisame is above Biju level since his 30% chakra is more than that of Kyubi.

:oh

[Nae'blis]

Kisame hit Asuma with the Samehada, but Asuma was using chakra later.Inconsistency in the manga is not something I can argue against. But, lets say that it is not inconsistent, what was special about what Kisame did with Naruto that he didn't do with Asuma/Gai?


How is it doubtful? Oro was caught in Itachi's genjutsu, and Kisame was caught in Kurenias genjutsu. Kurenai used her genjutsu against Itachi. Itachi has been around Itachi long enough to know to avoid Tsukiyomi, if he doesn't actually have a sharingan defense already.

Has is past tense meaning that no ever touched him before, not that no one will touch him. That is fact in the manga whether it's logical or not. Kisame said that he might not be able to defeat an opponent but Itachi can. That means that Kisame is weaker than Itachi, your argument would only be reasonable if Kisame wasn't the one that said it.It doesn't matter who said it, since it is all coming from Kishimoto so what characters say is supposed to be canon. And this is why I asked "does manga canon work in battledome?" In a matchup between Naruto vs. Kakuzu, would Kakuzu still fall to a bunshin feint trick?

Yeah... Orochimaru, Deidara, and Kakashi are noobs.
:oh
What? You don't even know what I was talking about. It was about speed, not power. And yes, Kurenai/Asuma are not worthy of much mention when discussing higher level shinobi the likes of Itachi and Kisame.

[sworder]

Well, you can still count Kakashi in on that. He was unable to track Itachi going behind him. Or those three Uchihas with three tomoe sharingan incapable of defending against Itachi.

Kisame is hella fast, but Itachi is now slouch either.

[maStneliS]

I'm going to go with Kisame on this one, his awesome sword pwns all :)

[Hannibal]

Itachi prime would pull it out with help from his friend, Optimus Prime.

[Topher]

So because Itachi called Kurenai/Kakashi/Asuma "name"-san, then he is inferior to them? Kisame's way of speaking to Itachi is as irrelevant as him following the suggestions Itachi makes. Disregarding whatever nonsense Kishi puts in his characters mouths, from what we have seen from them it is obvious Kisame is at the least equal if not stronger than Itachi.

Is the battledome about what is said, or about knowing the abilities of the respective parties involved? Doesn't battledome remove all CIS/PIS/DEM/KFW from battle scenarios? I'm not normally in this subforum, so I need this explained to me.

and im the one making fail arguments huh?

its to be expected of course, for one to believe kisame can beat itachi, one has to disregard many things in the manga.

its the same as when madara and pein were first introduced. it was obvious who was calling the shots and is more powerful, but of course haters were in denial.

[Nae'blis]

^ did you even read my post? Maybe you just didn't understand.

[Munboy Dracule O'Brian]

if kisame can take on itachi, why did he doupt his abilities to face jiraiya but had confidence in itachi?

Well they both obliviously heard of Jiraiya and Jiraiya has a reputation of being damn powerful and being a Sannin, now all other members of Akatsuki would doubt their abilities against Jiraiya minus Pein, Kakuzu, Sasori, Madara and possibly Zetsu

he knows he is inferior to itachi, even in recent chapters he is carrying out itachi's bidding.

Perhaps he has respect for Itachi, after all they are the only other members of Akatsuki that get along with their partner

furthermore we have already seen itachi using suiton ninjutsu which means he can easily copy whatever kisame is dishing out at him. but i doubt it would even amount to that since he would get genjutsu raped even before the battle begun.

True, except for the Genjutsu part couldn't he use Mizubunshins

its very clear who the superior shinobi is, only haters will believe kisame can hold his own against itachi.

He might be able to depends really, if they match is mainly an exchange of Ninjutsu Kisame wins, if its Genjutsu Itachi wins, Taijutsu Kisame+super strength+Samehada, Itachi would probably with Amaterasu, but if Kisame can dodge and keep out of sight for a some time while the Mangekyou damages Itachi's sight

kisame is bijuu level, but the bijuu's are the uchiha's pets.

Yeah thats why the Uchiha clan hid while the Kyuubi attacked Konoha :amuse, Bijuu are not Uchiha pets Madara is the only known Uchiha to summon only one Bijuu the Kyuubi, but it never said anything about him being able to control it, now if you said Bijuu are Shodai's pets that would be more believable

Itachi will be screwed once Kisame touches him with Samehada, chakra gone and everything.

Doesn't Kisame have to have to sort of slice the are around them to suck the chakra

Uchiha's might be friends with Kyubi, but Kisame is above Biju level since his 30% chakra is more than that of Kyubi.

No, Kisame hasn't got more chakra then Kyuubi, KN1+ probably has more



its to be expected of course, for one to believe kisame can beat itachi, one has to disregard many things in the manga.

I also see the manga not showing ethers full ability

its the same as when madara and pein were first introduced. it was obvious who was calling the shots and is more powerful, but of course haters were in denial.

Well show me who denies that after when he said he orders him, but everyone knows its because of his years of combat and not the Sharingan

[Topher]

Well they both obliviously heard of Jiraiya and Jiraiya has a reputation of being damn powerful and being a Sannin, now all other members of Akatsuki would doubt their abilities against Jiraiya minus Pein, Kakuzu, Sasori, Madara and possibly Zetsu

itachi had pwned a sannin at age 11, i don't see him doupting his abilities against jiraiya. furthermore after seeing jiraiya go all out, besides his hair and toad stomach jutsu i haven't been impressed.

itachi's character is way more complex then the lower tiers of akatsuki and recent manga chapters shows IMO he is superior to the sannins.



Perhaps he has respect for Itachi, after all they are the only other members of Akatsuki that get along with their partner

yea right.......

is it respect that made kisame doupt his abilities, but have confidence in itachi? unlike itachi kisame is a simple character with no evidence of having any other motives besides loving to fight and following itachi. so i don't see the reason he would pretend to be weaker then itachi.



True, except for the Genjutsu part couldn't he use Mizubunshins



He might be able to depends really, if they match is mainly an exchange of Ninjutsu Kisame wins, if its Genjutsu Itachi wins, Taijutsu Kisame+super strength+Samehada, Itachi would probably with Amaterasu, but if Kisame can dodge and keep out of sight for a some time while the Mangekyou damages Itachi's sight

the fight would involve every area of the shinobi skills. while itachi is shown to be profficient in genjutsu, taijutsu, and genjutsu; kisame is only profficient in taijutsu and ninjutsu(mainly suitons, which makes him average)



Yeah thats why the Uchiha clan hid while the Kyuubi attacked Konoha :amuse, Bijuu are not Uchiha pets Madara is the only known Uchiha to summon only one Bijuu the Kyuubi, but it never said anything about him being able to control it, now if you said Bijuu are Shodai's pets that would be more believable

did you forget it was an uchiha who summoned it, why would other uchihas go face their pet? did you also forget sasuke having his way with the kyubbi?



Doesn't Kisame have to have to sort of slice the are around them to suck the chakra



No, Kisame hasn't got more chakra then Kyuubi, KN1+ probably has more

1) kisame does not absorb chakra as easily as some of you are posting.

he wasn't absorbing chakra vs. the konoha jounins or team gai. the sword was shown to absorb chakra when it was leaking out of naruto, just touching a person does not cut it.




I also see the manga not showing ethers full ability]

the manga has shown enough to know who is the superior. do you need to see madara's and konan's full ability to know who would win a battle?



Well show me who denies that after when he said he orders him, but everyone knows its because of his years of combat and not the Sharingan

i don't understand what your getting at here.

[narutodestructo]

Itachi easily. MS that fishie.

[Munboy Dracule O'Brian]

itachi had pwned a sannin at age 11, i don't see him doupting his abilities against jiraiya. furthermore after seeing jiraiya go all out, besides his hair and toad stomach jutsu i haven't been impressed.

itachi's character is way more complex then the lower tiers of akatsuki and recent manga chapters shows IMO he is superior to the sannins.

Nope, Orochimaru hasn't shown anything to keep up w/Hermit mode and Itachi probably will not have anything ether, same goes for Kisame



yea right.......

is it respect that made kisame doupt his abilities, but have confidence in itachi? unlike itachi kisame is a simple character with no evidence of having any other motives besides loving to fight and following itachi. so i don't see the reason he would pretend to be weaker then itachi.

Kisame is simple minded what can you say



the fight would involve every area of the shinobi skills. while itachi is shown to be profficient in genjutsu, taijutsu, and genjutsu; kisame is only profficient in taijutsu and ninjutsu(mainly suitons, which makes him average)

True



did you forget it was an uchiha who summoned it, why would other uchihas go face their pet? did you also forget sasuke having his way with the kyubbi?

Yeah the Uchiha founder not a regular Uchiha, and the Uchiha were meant to protect Konoha, lol and they were no where to be seen when Konoha almost got destroyed, I didn't see Sasuke having his way with Kyuubi, bu I did see Naruto rejecting Kyuubi's power and Sasuke just popping it



1) kisame does not absorb chakra as easily as some of you are posting.

Doesn't he have to wave it around someone who releases chakra?, because thats what I was trying to say

he wasn't absorbing chakra vs. the konoha jounins or team gai. the sword was shown to absorb chakra when it was leaking out of naruto, just touching a person does not cut it.



True


the manga has shown enough to know who is the superior. do you need to see madara's and konan's full ability to know who would win a battle?


I think this whole thing needs to be cleared up in the manga first


i don't understand what your getting at here.

I meant that I dare you to show me anybody who denies Madara ordering Pein after he admitted it to Zetsu

[Topher]

Nope, Orochimaru hasn't shown anything to keep up w/Hermit mode and Itachi probably will not have anything ether, same goes for Kisame

lol oro nor itachi have yet to have an all out battle, and what they have shown so far is far more impressive then jiraiya. jiraiya needs the help of 2 other kage level shinobis to pull hermit mode and hold his own against other shinobis, i find it lame. even then itachi is shown to be pwning oro, who was considered the genius of his team. itachi>>> the sannins.





Kisame is simple minded what can you say





True





Yeah the Uchiha founder not a regular Uchiha, and the Uchiha were meant to protect Konoha, lol and they were no where to be seen when Konoha almost got destroyed, I didn't see Sasuke having his way with Kyuubi, bu I did see Naruto rejecting Kyuubi's power and Sasuke just popping it

http://img4.onemanga.com/mangas/00000004/00000309/04-05.jpg

can you read?

what is the kyubbi saying himself?

it does not involve naruto. you must be disregarding many facts in the manga like naeblis to believe the things you post.




Doesn't he have to wave it around someone who releases chakra?, because thats what I was trying to say


maybe but not many shinobis release chakra in such a way.



I meant that I dare you to show me anybody who denies Madara ordering Pein after he admitted it to Zetsu

my point was that it was very clear that madara was the boss since he was first introduced with pein. the chapter in the manga where he ordered pein to go catch the kyuubi, but many were in denial about it.

[Munboy Dracule O'Brian]

lol oro nor itachi have yet to have an all out battle, and what they have shown so far is far more impressive then jiraiya. jiraiya needs the help of 2 other kage level shinobis to pull hermit mode and hold his own against other shinobis, i find it lame. even then itachi is shown to be pwning oro, who was considered the genius of his team. itachi>>> the sannins.




Orochimaru is gone, and he went all out with KN4, Itachi will probably go all out with Sasuke, and what they have shown doesn't keep up with Hermit mode, Jiraiya>Itachi >Tsuande and Orochimaru, c'mon Itachi said himself he can't take him on w/o dying and w/Hermit mode it would be impossible


http://img4.onemanga.com/mangas/00000004/00000309/04-05.jpg

can you read?

what is the kyubbi saying himself?

it does not involve naruto. you must be disregarding many facts in the manga like naeblis to believe the things you post.



Well I'm not surprised that you would find it as fact seeing as we know very little of it, at that time Naruto didn't want its power, but do we know what would happen if he did want its power?



maybe but not many shinobis release chakra in such a way.


It may work in another way then I mentioned


my point was that it was very clear that madara was the boss since he was first introduced with pein. the chapter in the manga where he ordered pein to go catch the kyuubi, but many were in denial about it.

And I said can you prove people deny it after he admitted to Zetsu

[Kieuseru]

Inconsistency in the manga is not something I can argue against. But, lets say that it is not inconsistent, what was special about what Kisame did with Naruto that he didn't do with Asuma/Gai?
http://groups.msn.com/NarutoMangaReturns/volume16big.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=29170
^Asuma wasn't gathering any chakra up.
http://groups.msn.com/NarutoMangaReturns/volume17big.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=37786
^Naruto was gathering chakra to summon, so if it isn't inconsistent than that means that Kisame can only take away the opposing chakra if it is being used.

Kurenai used her genjutsu against Itachi. Itachi has been around Itachi long enough to know to avoid Tsukiyomi, if he doesn't actually have a sharingan defense already.
http://groups.msn.com/NarutoMangaReturns/volume16big.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=29171
^Kisame was caught in Kurenais genjutsu on the second to last panel. Kisames knows to avoid Itachi's eyes and probably Itachi's hands too. But just because he knows about it doesn't mean he can effectively avoid it.
It doesn't matter who said it, since it is all coming from Kishimoto so what characters say is supposed to be canon. And this is why I asked "does manga canon work in battledome?" In a matchup between Naruto vs. Kakuzu, would Kakuzu still fall to a bunshin feint trick?
What characters say should be considered canon to a certain extent. Kisame had full knowledge of himself and extensive knowledge on Itachi, so when he compared them what he said should be taken as canon.
as for Kakuzu falling for Naruto's bunshin feint, if Kakuzu has knowledge of Naruto, then no he wouldn't. If Kakuzu didn't have knowledge of Naruto (so basically in the same position as he was the first time) then I don't see why he shouldn't fall for it.

[Scorp A Derp]

60% Kisame takes this

[Niko Bellic]

Saying "prime" doesn't the make the character any stronger.

But I would still say Itachi.

[freaklovesgaara]

kisame's gonna kick some @$$!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Pimp of Pimps]

Kisame's testicles are too much for two Itachi primes.

[DrunkenYoshimaster]

Itachi Prime by far. He's gotten weaker and blinder and is still the leader. Kisame has gotten stronger by absorbing more with Kisame and he still is wary of him.

[Shoddragon]

itachi had pwned a sannin at age 11, i don't see him doupting his abilities against jiraiya. furthermore after seeing jiraiya go all out, besides his hair and toad stomach jutsu i haven't been impressed.

itachi's character is way more complex then the lower tiers of akatsuki and recent manga chapters shows IMO he is superior to the sannins.





yea right.......

is it respect that made kisame doupt his abilities, but have confidence in itachi? unlike itachi kisame is a simple character with no evidence of having any other motives besides loving to fight and following itachi. so i don't see the reason he would pretend to be weaker then itachi.





the fight would involve every area of the shinobi skills. while itachi is shown to be profficient in genjutsu, taijutsu, and genjutsu; kisame is only profficient in taijutsu and ninjutsu(mainly suitons, which makes him average)





did you forget it was an uchiha who summoned it, why would other uchihas go face their pet? did you also forget sasuke having his way with the kyubbi?





1) kisame does not absorb chakra as easily as some of you are posting.

he wasn't absorbing chakra vs. the konoha jounins or team gai. the sword was shown to absorb chakra when it was leaking out of naruto, just touching a person does not cut it.






the manga has shown enough to know who is the superior. do you need to see madara's and konan's full ability to know who would win a battle?





i don't understand what your getting at here.

Based on the manga, Madara was at LEAST one of the very first if not the very founder of the Uchiha Clan.
SO that point is sort of void.Why?

Ever seen Blade:Trinity? In it, Dracula, who is supposed to be the very first, Original Vampire. he can shapeshift, but more importantly, the main thing he can do his descendants can't is walk in sunlight. some things are not always passed on. for example, shodaime is Tsunade's grandpa, yes she can not use mokuton or have any sort of biju taming/suppression abilities.

and Itachi wouldn't know much about the Kyuubi seeing as he himself was still probably not even 5 years old when it was rampaging Konoha and such.

so even reading the things in the uchiha temple, he wouldn't know much about the kyuubi. as for the samehada, how do you know the chakra was actually visible? I mean to the characters, not to us the audience? Kisame could just sense the chakra gathering and absorb it with samehada. how do you know the samehada AUTOMATICALLY sucks in any chakra its near? if it did kisame's chakra might get drained as well.

your points are flawed and really have no holdings without some kind of explanation.

and Konan has been with Pein far longer than with Madara, same with Kisame and Itachi. Madara probably wouldn't know Madara's abilities and vice versa. we are talking about two members of Akatski who have been members, as far as we know, since both of them joined. both are powerful and have jutsu we have yet to experience. its very different in reality than the way YOU see it.

[Elite Uchiha]

Itachi Prime by far. He's gotten weaker and blinder and is still the leader. Kisame has gotten stronger by absorbing more with Kisame and he still is wary of him.

If Itachi is Prime that means he is in top notch strength, that means he isnt blind or has lost any power. And when has Itachi gotten weaker....


Still Kisame almost got trapped by kurenai's genjutsu...so imagine what MS would do to him.

[Yellow]

Itachi's genjutsu capabilities would give him an advantage especially how Kisame likes to charge into battle. I think Itachi would win.

[Cooli]

Kisame cause His sword would drain Itachi's chakra b4 he could use MS
and eventually he wont even be able to use regular Sharingan and with his messed up eye sight he wont be able to see

[masamune1]

@Nae'blis Kurenai used at least a B-Rank Genjutsu on Itachi, and part of it's effectiveness is that it was quick, so normally even if he could fight out of it he would have a Kunai in his throat before getting the chance to.
IT was not a Genin-level GEnjutsu and she had no idea that he was that good.

Having said that Itachi wins.

Actually, scratch that. Kisame would'nt bother showing up for the fight.

[Jαmes]

The only real advantage Itachi's got is his Genjutsu-MSSharingan ability. Kisame's advatages are his chakra-sucking Samehada, his insane chakra capacity, and physical superiority to Itachi. Though I would love having Kisame beat Itachi, the Uchiha's advantage is enough to eke ahead of all of Kisame's advantages... Too bad...

[Elite Uchiha]

Some of you guys are acting like Kisame can hit Itachi. I mean hes gonna get mind raped.

[Jαmes]

Itachi is not untouchable.

[uchiha-alia]

first of all, we havent seen either of them in their prime,kisame can pwn all bijuu so he easily takes this we know itachi has his MS, superb genjutsu great taijutsu, and probaby loads of ninjutsu we havent seen. now i dont think kisames too great at genjutsu repelling, and it probably comes down to just itachi genjutsuing him then taking him out with ms or whatever. this match up isnt good for kisame who is bad against genjutsu users, he could probably pwn any taijutsu master and drown any ninjutsu man.

[kyuubinaruto12]

itachi would beat the hell outa kisame but maybe it could end in a tie

[Ico]

Itachi,,only if he catches him in genjutsu(Great possibility)
Kisame could win if he creates alot of water like against team Gai and seperates himself from Itachi. Then uses his uber chakra and strength to kill him. But since Itachi would probably just genjutsu him off the bat,,Itachi wins.

[Nikushimi]

Kisame is more than a decade older than Itachi, yet defers to him as the superior ninja and obeys his every command. Uh...the only explanation for that is that Itachi is simply more powerful. The databooks themselves hint at this as being the truth, and Itachi himself stated that he would have no trouble against Kakashi, whereas Kisame might sustain an injury (while holding back, lol).

Still, Kisame's no pushover; a monster who makes even the Sannin look like frail children, Kisame possesses strength that would immasculate Tsunade and Ninjutsu capabilities that would make those of Jiraiya and Orochimaru look pitiful by comparison. The icing on the powerhouse cake comes in the form of the massive weapon known as "Samehada", a chakra-draining and even chakra-stopping sword. According to mythology, Samehada should even allow Kisame to use the chakra he has absorbed, multiplying his power several fold (from what I read, the fish Samehada was said to grant its boss 5x his original power by latching onto him).

Kisame's downfall is his apparent lack of resistance towards Genjutsu, which happens to be Itachi's specialty. And considering fecking Itachi is the best Genjutsu user we've seen so far, I have to hand the victory to him.

[Elite Uchiha]

Itachi, obviously.....

[.Nagato.]

"Kisame hasnt shown anything that could dispell tsukiyomi."

"Itachi wins."

[Gaara of the Sand]

I say Kisame because he knows not to look into Itachi's eyes and would know to keep his distance and outlast Itachi

[spectaa]

Kisame knows itachi hides his tears in the rain, Kisame knows itachi is too emo to fight eldery and cut little kids legs so he does it solo. He shows respect when he actually pity the poor guy and his ambitions. He knows too much that mangekyou won't be enough to be at the top. Kisame isn't searching for anything, he doesn't try to obtain more power, he doesn't feel the need to hide his true self, he got everything he needs, he is enjoying his life, at night he sleeps like a baby. Kisame win.

[Kira]

Kisame solos :dupe

[Nikushimi]

o_O


This thread is painful. How can you think that Kisame wins? Or are you guys just playing the Devil's Advocates? :/

[TonyG416]

Itachi wins.

[L. Lawliet]

Kisame is an absolute powerhouse, and may be better overall than Itachi in ninjutsu and such pursuits. However, Itachi could destroy Kisame with a well-placed Genjutsu.

[narutorulez215]

i think itachi could crush kisame i meen kisame has more chakra and the sword but this would make itachi more on his game.He would use his chakra sparingly so that when kisame ran out from using it so mutch he would use sharigen and that would crush him with his ninjutsus and genjutsus

[Alex]

Itachi. catch kisame in regular genjutsu, then burninate him with amaterasu.

[macragge101]

[QUOTE=Nikushimi;13572374]Kisame is more than a decade older than Itachi, yet defers to him as the superior ninja and obeys his every command. Uh...the only explanation for that is that Itachi is simply more powerful. The databooks themselves hint at this as being the truth, and Itachi himself stated that he would have no trouble against Kakashi, whereas Kisame might sustain an injury (while holding back, lol).]


Kisame just isnt as smart as Itachi, so he isnt the leader.It doesnt mean he isnt stronger.Kisame has some of the highest chakra seen on naruto. Even if Itachi tried to copy his techniques, they wouldnt be as strong, but kisame already knows itachis moves

[sworder]

You were only playing devil's advocate/trying to piss people off/controlling their emotions like the puppet master you are.

You may have lost the war, but great news! You didn't want to win anyway. In fact, you lost intentionally, so by winning they are actually doing exactly what you wanted them to do. They're like tiny ants that you can crush, except they are about the same size as you (maybe on average a little bigger).

Examples:

Bad: I meant every word of this thread. I was trying to get you guys to like me. The only puppet here is me :(

Good: Wow you guys seem pretty angry at me. I bet you're all fuming and drooling over your keyboards because you have a glandular problem that causes uncontrollable spittle production. This is just where I want you, by the way. I entered gimmick mode the moment I saw all you nerds and I just couldn't help but toy with you a little bit. Ok, enjoy your EVE Online thread boys now that I've caused you all run around with it like you were posting as bulls and I was posting as a piece of red cloth. Why don't you pelibeans malt over that idea for a while.

[Khris]

based on what we've seen until now; there are three ways for this fight to end.

First Scenario: Kisame flushes the ground with his water thus keeping distance and hiding from itachi, where he might attack him with his sharks, or with his water clones, but then again itachi can see all of this, where he finds an opening he can aqquire raven jutsu that might not be powerfull enough to beat kisame nor will fire work on water, but though kisame can't beat itachi and itachi can't beat kisame in this state; so its a tie.

Second Scenario: Before Kisame Does anything Itachi would charge at kismae, and use his techs he copied along the way and outsmart him before even touching him, ending it with a tsukyomi.


Third Scenario: AMERATSU!! would just finish everything before it evens starts.

Tie,Itachi,Itachi

Kisame 0:2 Itachi.

[DremolitoX]

Hmm how could kisame possibly win?

We've all seen him follow Itachi's orders like a bitch.

[Distracted]

Well this has gotten grossly off track and is turning into a bit of a fandom flame war. For the sake of those that posted seriously I won't trash this. Thread locked.