Trial Tournament - Risu vs. Raikage (Round 2, Match 2)

[Kuya]

Hey Everyone. So this is the trial tournament. Real tournament will start soon after this. So observe, vote, and give any input on how to better the tournament for the real one. Thanks!

THE MATCHES AND SETTINGS WERE CHOSEN AT RANDOM BY MY GF.

Setting For Round 2 - New York City
Tournament Rules

1. Vote on the clear victor and it is recommended you state why they would in.
2. Only 1 vote allowed. If later you are persuaded by someone and choose to vote for the other team, then only that vote will count.
3. No Plot No Jutsu. (Naruto doesn’t defeat Kakuzu, Sasori, and everyone just because Kishimoto won’t let him die.)
4. No filler jutsu’s.
5. No Giant or Boss summons except for Enma (Sarutobi) and Pakkun (Kakashi).
6. KWGoD, Aoba, and the Gai hype (Chuck Norris type hype) not allowed. Otherwise, one could have all 3 on their team and own EVERYONE. Please try and be serious and just go off their skills
7. Experience of fighting WITH or AGAINST ninja's are in play. (I.E. if you choose Kiba-Shino-Hinata, they may work better since they are a team and know eachother's strengths and weaknesses. Or... Kakuzu will know to fight Hidan from a great distance since he doesn't want his blood drawn, and because they are partners. Hidan will have an advantage of characters who don't know of his ability). EXPERIENCE IS ONLY IN AFFECT FROM CHAPTER 341AND BEFORE.
8. No Prep Time.
9. It’s a team fight. Team vs. Team
10. 1 point for a vote in the polls. 2 points for a vote as a post in this thread.
11. If caught bribing for votes or cheating (making aliases), you will be disqualified from the tournament.

***Please try and be clear with who you think wins. It would be koo if u can say at the bottom of ur post who wins. (i.e. Winner = Lil Wayne)

Risu vs. Raikage

Risu
Team Risu

1. Gaara (Sasuke Retrieval Arc)
2. Post Naruto (Pre-Wind Training, KN2 Max)
3. Post Shikimaru w/ Chakra Blades
4. Post Sakura
5. Pre-Lee (Chuunin Exams, Gates OK but limited like in the manga)

vs.

Raikage
Team Raikage

1. Old Sarutobi w/ Enma
2. Sasuke (CS2)
3. Sick Kimimaro (CS2 Allowed)
4. Pre-Shikamaru
5. Pre-Ino (Chuunin Exams)

[MISTNINJA]

Team Raikage wins because Sarutobi is unmatched in this battle and he has Kimi to back him up. Sarutobi is the one that tips the scales in their favor. Even post skip noone is his match. A sick Kimi in NY is devestating as long as he doesn't collapse during the battle. the post skip characters are strong but not enough to defeat the 3rd Hokage.

[Kyon]

Risu
Team Risu

1. Gaara (Sasuke Retrieval Arc)
2. Post Naruto (Pre-Wind Training, KN2 Max)
3. Post Shikimaru w/ Chakra Blades
4. Post Sakura
5. Pre-Lee (Chuunin Exams, Gates OK but limited like in the manga)

vs.

Raikage
Team Raikage

1. Old Sarutobi w/ Enma
2. Sasuke (CS2)
3. Sick Kimimaro (CS2 Allowed)
4. Pre-Shikamaru
5. Pre-Ino (Chuunin Exams)

Hmm...on one hand, Raikage has the terribly overpowered Sarutobi, and Sasuke/Kimi if not much else. Strategically, Risu's team has the advantage as well as a large teamwork advantage.

Sakura can heal any wounds inflicted, KN2 is an absolute beast who can probably go toe-to-toe with Sarutobi for a bit, and Lee w/ 5 gates could take both pre Shika and Ino. Sakura and Shika could defeat Kimimaro (Shika binds him, remember there is a LOT of debris from this fight that will help Shika out) and Gaara could handle CS2 Sasuke. Even if the teams decide to fight as teams, Risu still has an advantage in teamwork and roughly equal power, so his team will come out on top.

[Feral]

I have to say Risu has this one..

His team is full of mid-high Jounin levels who can easily eliminate the weaker contenders in the fight (hell, his Genin can probably take out both other Genins at once if he uses gates).

The really important battle boils down to:

Gaara (SRA)
Naruto (KN2 Max, pre-wind training)
Post Shikamaru
Post Sakura

vs

Old Sarutobi (w/ Enma)
Kimimaro
CS2 Sasuke

I agree with the post above, that Gaara can take CS2 Sasuke, both Shika and Sakura can handle Kimimaro while Naruto can distract Sarutobi.

Also, as stated in Kyon's post, even if it does turn out to be a team battle, I think Sarutobi would have trouble keeping up with a whole team, and Kimi + CS2 Sasuke would fall against teamwork if they tried anything. Lastly, teamwork is actually a better situation for Risu's team, because he has post-Shikamaru, who can come up with brilliant plans.. even if pre-shika tries any plans, post is definitely way ahead of him.

[Spell]

Here is a small, short discription of my team (with some supplements) which I posted in previous fight also:

Shikamaru – team strategist, kage jutsus if needed
Gaara (SRA) – Shikamaru’s guard, flying
Naruto (KN2) – Raw power, kage bunshins, rasengan, Weapon in Shikamaru’s strategy
Sakura (post) – Medic nin, great destructive power, smart
Lee (exam) – fast, strong, determined

This is 50% of my team power, the next 50% is strategy.

And here is a discription of the strategy:
Since there are no preparation time, my team must “create it” during the fight. The plan is simple:
When opponent team jutsus and fighting styles are known enough for Shika, Gaara covers him with the sand for a few seconds. During that time my team strategist outsmarts opponent’s team and prepares a plan. There is no way opponents would be able to interrupt that process. Gaara’s sand shield and Naruto’s raw power supported by Kyuubi’s chakra and/or kage bunshins are a hindrance which could stop shinobi from highest tier for enough time to prepare a plan (if you don’t believe – see Naruto vs Orochimaru fight)

No one from Raikage's team has got enough power to break that defence with easy.

Location is also my advantage, condider that Gaara is is able drain sand from parks and probably from debris and dust too (sand is one of a materials that concrete includes).

Debris is also an advantage for Shikamaru's shadow binding, and I've got no doubt this place would be devastated enough. (KN2, gated Lee, Sakura)

Note that dust would be a big disadvantage for sivk Kimmmimaro, he would probably die petty quickly in that case.

When plan is prepared there is no way to fail (consider that Shikamaru is much smarter than me). I constructed my team in a way which could allow it to do almost everyting. So let’s see what my team is able to do:

- flying – Gaara can transport each member (using his sand)
- healing – both Naruto and Sakura can heal themself ( Naruto is able to heal almost every wound), Sakura can heal other members, Gaara is probably able to heal himself since he is a jinchuuriki (but we don’t know it for sure), Lee is able to open healing gate
- bunshins – Naruto is able to distract everyone by using his kage bunshins, oponents quantity advantage is no longer a factor
- Shika’s kage manipulations – Shikamaru is able to bind everyone, for enough time to complete the plan
- Protection – Gaara is able to protect enyone with his sand, Naruto is able to mould his chakra and use it as a weapon/ shield
- Destructive power – Naruto (by himself), Naruto’s rasengan (strenghten by Kyuubi’s chakra), Sakura’s taijutsu, gated Lee taijutsu, I could mention Gaara’s coffin/funeral too(especially 200 meters underground)
- Teamwork - Naruto and Sakura- both from team 7, Gaara and Lee fought each other during exams, Gaara helped Lee during Kimi fight (they know what they are able to do), Naruto and Sakura saw Lee vs Gaara fight => they are well informed about each other abilities


I think my greatest advantage is teamwork and second is raw power, my team's supremacy in those matters is undeniable.

[narutofangd]

I'm sorry old Sarutobi more than makes up for the dead weight that is Ino

[Kung Lao]

I'll write a noteworthy reply when I'm back from studying.

[CrazyMoronX]

Risu
Team Risu

1. Gaara (Sasuke Retrieval Arc)
2. Post Naruto (Pre-Wind Training, KN2 Max)
3. Post Shikimaru w/ Chakra Blades
4. Post Sakura
5. Pre-Lee (Chuunin Exams, Gates OK but limited like in the manga)

vs.

Raikage
Team Raikage

1. Old Sarutobi w/ Enma
2. Sasuke (CS2)
3. Sick Kimimaro (CS2 Allowed)
4. Pre-Shikamaru
5. Pre-Ino (Chuunin Exams)[/quote]

This is a very interesting match, closer than anyone will give it credit for because of Sarutobi.

Shika would be a huge factor in this fight, I think. With his post-skip, post-chakra blades abilities, he could bind any of the other team. Including Sarutobi, IMO.

Obviously Sarutobi is the hardest one to take down, so they will go after him first. Shikamaru can and will bind him, Sasuke, and Kimimaro before they open up CS2.

Naruto can take any of them out with an Oodama Rasengan; but, he'll go for Saru first. While Shika has them binding, Sakura will go for Kimimaro with her super strength, while Gaara will look to settle the score with Sasuke. Shika and Ino pre-skip might give Lee some trouble, well, Shika might. I would say he's fast and strong enough to take both of them on at the same time, especially with gates.

It wouldn't be that easy, but I can see team work sealing the victory for Risu's team. Once Sarutobi is down, the rest will be much easier. With Shikamaru's enhanced binding abilitis, Sarutobi will have his hands full, as did Kakuzu at first. Shika can't hold Saru for long, of course, but he only needs a small window for Naruto to land an Oodama on him.

Kimimaro would die taking a direct punch from Sakura. Sasuke would get killed by most of Gaara's sand maneuvers. Shika and Ino would get their necks or spines snapped by Lee.

[Gooba]

Raikage wins, Old Saru has no peers on this one. At best I'd call the 3 post-skip people Jounins, and we have seen Saru nearly kill 3 Kages at once. Shika isn't so much smarter than him, Saru has 5 in int, is called the Professor, and was able to devise a plan to blow up Nidaime and Shodaime, and when that didn't work he figured out a way to beat 2 invincible enemies. We didn't see much from him since as soon as he got serious about the fight he realized his enemies were immortal and he needed to go right to the Death God.

(if you don’t believe – see Naruto vs Orochimaru fight)That was 2 tails, and a whole lot more power than he is allowed in this fight.

[Orga777]

Risu in a stunning upset I think. Naruto has a BEAST of a jutsu, and the team work that is just reaking off Risu's team is just extrodinary. The ONLY character that is really much of a factor for Raikage's team is Sarutobi. Sasuke would be trashed by Post Skip Naruto, especially after wind training, Kimi would go down to a combined effort of Shika and Sakura, and Lee if needed. Ino is... well Ino, and Pre Shika has got nothing on any of the other team since he isn't exactly as threatening as his Post Skip self. Gaara will be able to hold Sarutobi off long enough for Saru's teammates to start dropping. And the more people that go and help, the more chakra Saru will need to waste, and that can be bad for him, especially against Naruto who has vast amounts of chakra and spams clones as much as he does. Saru will eventually be overpowered by a combined might of Naruto, Shikamaru, and perhaps Gaara if he is still functioning at the time. Like I said before... Risu's team is going to be hard to beat...

Winner: Team Risu

[Kai]

Godamn this Sarutobi.

One of the closest matches I've had to think about, but I say Raikage.

I might change my mind at any time, so I won't vote just yet.

[Blue]

Rizu's team is hideously outmatched - I hate to break this to you all, but Sarutobi can take the entire other team by himself. As Gooba pointed out, he very nearly disposed of three Hokage-level opponents by himself. Giving him Enma is simply ridiculous.

Honestly, unless this is in a desert (in which case Gaara's power multiplies tenfold) the entire other team is a nonfactor. And I love Sakura, so that's not easy to say.

[Blue]

Here kids, check this out. It's Sarutobi's profile (I jacked it off Leafninja.com)

http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/5517/sarujh5.jpg


Now, the important thing to notice here is his ninja skills (http://www.leafninja.com/StatsGuide.php) chart. Note it's completely maxed out except for stamina, speed, and power - the three skills that you'd expect him to lose as an old man.

That means he has the highest possible stats in seals, ninjutsu, genjutsu, taijustu, and intelligence. And he probably had the highest possible in the other three too, before he aged - and despite his age, they're still jounin-level.

[Spell]

That was 2 tails, and a whole lot more power than he is allowed in this fight.
During Oro fight Naruto didn't go 2 tails. He bashed Oro with one tail then went 3 tails.

Here kids, check this out. It's Sarutobi's profile (I jacked it off Leafninja.com)
Here kid check this out xD It's Kakashi's profile. As you can see his stats are not so inferior to Sarutobi's. Well if I remember, something's wrong with my internet and I can't see this page :/
http://www.leafninja.com/fullbio.php?p=Hatake_Kakashi

Do not base so much on databooks, Kishimoto messed them up in a few places :)

And also I'm Risu not Rizu :), and I would be glad if you read my statement.

Seriously Sarutobi was a great shinobi but I don't see how he could manage with Shikamaru's strategy supported by the rest of my team.

[Blue]

And also I'm Risu not Rizu :), and I would be glad if you read my statement.Gomen. :sweatdrop
And I did read the entire thread.
It's true that Kakashi's stats to not appear to be heavily inferior to Sarutobi's; however, how high Saru's stats are is not the point. The point is that they were apparently completely maxed out at one point. He is the God of Shinobi.

If you'd like my interpretation of events, here we are - I apologize if it's not as imaginative as yours is, but given that Raikage has Sarutobi on his team, not much imagination is required.

Sarutobi promises to make the best of his team and not to lose any of his precious nakama. He therefore immediately orders Ino to the back, and places Shikamaru (henceforth known as Shika1) into a supporting position behind Kimimaro.

He then immediately goes on the offensive and blows his strongest Katon.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/spriteninja/saru1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/spriteninja/saru2.jpg
As Gaara does not yet have enough sand to create a barrier around anyone but himself (it takes time to create sand from concrete), everyone else on that team is exposed to the fire. Lee and Shikamaru are incapacitated immediately, and Sakura and Naruto are heavily wounded. (Actually, it's debatable if Gaara could survive it, but let's assume he can.)
Before you comment on the power of the Katon, realize that genin are not immortal summoned kages. Sasuke's Katon, much less powerful than Sarutobi's, disabled Kyuubified Naruto in one hit and turned rock into lava(Which is why I said Gaara's ability to defend against it is dubious), and that Sarutobi's specialty - being the Fire Shadow - is katon jutsu.

Saurtobi knocks aside Gaara's sand as easily as Guy or Kakashi did and proceeds to beat him silly.

At this point CS2 Sasuke laughs his ass off at Naruto, which sets him into KN2. Kimimaro and Sasuke immediately engage it while Shika1 traps the injured Sakura. Realizing that it can't be easily defeated, Sarutobi has Emna entrap KN2 in the staff cage while he performs a sealing jutsu. (Remember that Sarutobi knows every jutsu in Konoha.) Naruto reverts to normal and is quickly defeated.

Fin.

[Kung Lao]

Setting For Round 2 - New York City

Ehh, never been to NY, and the only thing I know about it that it has a bunch of high buildings bulked together.


Risu
Team Risu

1. Gaara (Sasuke Retrieval Arc)
2. Post Naruto (Pre-Wind Training, KN2 Max)
3. Post Shikimaru w/ Chakra Blades
4. Post Sakura
5. Pre-Lee (Chuunin Exams, Gates OK but limited like in the manga)

vs.

Raikage
Team Raikage

1. Old Sarutobi w/ Enma
2. Sasuke (CS2)
3. Sick Kimimaro (CS2 Allowed)
4. Pre-Shikamaru
5. Pre-Ino (Chuunin Exams)

Both teams are without preparation time and thus are only limited to a short amount of time to discuss strategies. Those who know about the fighting abilities of the others:

Sasuke with/without CS forms - Naruto (preskip ~ changes: Oodama Rasengan, Kyuubi control)
Sasuke without CS forms and without 3 tomoe Sharingan - Sakura (preskip ~ changes: Chakra control-Strength, Medical techniques)
Kimimaro with/without CS forms - Gaara (SRA)
Shikamaru - Shikamaru (post skip ~ changes: Chakra blades, Higher agility?)
Everyone on Risu's team - Ino

Now the battlefield advantages/disadvantages for different people:

+: Shikamaru / Shikamaru - Shadows from different buildings.
-: Gaara - His massive attacks can be stopped/weakened by the buildings, he can't use really wide attacks either, because of the distance of various buildings. (Unless there's some really wide place, in which case the buildings' Shadow exhale would be limited).

Risu's case is special, he doesn't really have a "main" consumer of points. Although one may argue, even the younger Shikamaru is an intelligent being, and the thing I really noticed the post skip Shikamaru improve in is his agility (shown in his fight against Hidan) in which case his throwable shadow bind jutsus also help a lot.
Sakura and Naruto can form a good team, as they know eachother from the very start, and Shikamaru and Ino can from a good team.

I'm really limited to time right now..

Why do so many people strongly believe that CS2 Sasuke is outmatched by SRA Gaara? Gaara is limited because of the above mentioned density of NY buildings (at least that's how I see it). CS 2 Sasuke has wings, so he can fly, he also has Black Chidori, which could pierce any of Gaara's defences except maybe the Ultimate Shukaku shield. That's avoidable though, and the only reason Kimimaro couldn't do it is because his spine was bound to the defense.

Shadow bind and intelligence is posessed by the younger Shikamaru also, negleting him isn't a smart move. I don't say that both of them are the same, but really, his intelligence was extraordinary even at that time. Feral, you say that they'd die pretty fast because of the strength difference, but then this thing can be applied to the other team also.

Risu in a stunning upset I think. Naruto has a BEAST of a jutsu, and the team work that is just reaking off Risu's team is just extrodinary. The ONLY character that is really much of a factor for Raikage's team is Sarutobi. Sasuke would be trashed by Post Skip Naruto, especially after wind training

This isn't a Naruto after the wind training, I don't get that last sentence of yours altogether. Why would he be trashed by Naruto?

I'll make a better post tomorrow.

[Spell]

Gomen. :sweatdrop
And I did read the entire thread.
It's true that Kakashi's stats to not appear to be heavily inferior to Sarutobi's; however, how high Saru's stats are is not the point. The point is that they were apparently completely maxed out at one point. He is the God of Shinobi.
No, actually Sarutobi was God of Shinobi. Old Sarutobi is no a shinobi he used to be. His chakra is considerably restricted and he isn't able to use many powerfull jutsus.

If you'd like my interpretation of events, here we are - I apologize if it's not as imaginative as yours is, but given that Raikage has Sarutobi on his team, not much imagination is required.
IMO much imagination is needed.

Sarutobi promises to make the best of his team and not to lose any of his precious nakama. He therefore immediately orders Ino to the back, and places Shikamaru (henceforth known as Shika1) into a supporting position behind Kimimaro.
Oh that's great :amuse, It would make much time for my team to preparate. Time needed to order this is at least few seconds, which is enough for Naruto to go Kyuubi mode and Gaara to gather some sand ( and maybe lee to go gates) Shikamaru would pprobably prepare few plans.

He then immediately goes on the offensive and blows his strongest Katon.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/spriteninja/saru1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/spriteninja/saru2.jpg
His strongest katon - Karyuu Endan is a B rank jutsu :amuse It won't work against my team.
As Gaara does not yet have enough sand to create a barrier around anyone but himself (it takes time to create sand from concrete), everyone else on that team is exposed to the fire.
You already gave the time for Gaara to prepare some sand. Furthermore he has got his own sand in a gourd. Your argument won't work. Besides in New York there are some parks, Gaara doesn't have to create sand only from concrete.
Lee and Shikamaru are incapacitated immediately, and Sakura and Naruto are heavily wounded. (Actually, it's debatable if Gaara could survive it, but let's assume he can.)
No. Gaara covers them and since Naruto is already in Kyuubi mode, no katon would work against him. Especially B ranked.
Sasuke's Katon, much less powerful than Sarutobi's, disabled Kyuubified Naruto in one hit and turned rock into lava
0.o What?


Saurtobi knocks aside Gaara's sand as easily as Guy or Kakashi did and proceeds to beat him silly.:laugh
When did Kakashi do this?
Gai is amazing Taijutsu user near his prime, Sarutobi old geezer and won't be able to do this so easily. Furthermore KN2 won't allow him to get near Gaara, Naruto was able to bash Orochimaru with one hit (only KN1). Sarutobi won't be a problem.

Besides it's not Gaara from chuunin exam, it's Gaara from SRA. He is much more powerfull and is able to fly.

Please state what jutsu would use Sarutobi to beat my team. The fact he was called a God of Shinobi doesn't make him a winner instantly. He would fail to shikamaru's strategy supported by my team's powerhouses.

Fin.
:amuse nope

[naruhina26]

Risu wins this one

[Spell]

Uh I somehow forgot to comment this:
Realizing that it can't be easily defeated, Sarutobi has Emna entrap KN2 in the staff cage while he performs a sealing jutsu.
I doubt Enma woulkd be able to entrap KN2. He was easily owned by Oro's snakes. Besides Sarutobi won't be able to perform sealing so easy. Sealing jutsus are short range, he would have to go into cage (hipothetically because I really doubt KN2 would be trapped by that cage) and it's a suicide.

(Remember that Sarutobi knows every jutsu in Konoha.)
He may have the knowledge of all jutsu in Konoha, but he isn't able to perform all jutsu Konoha ever produced.

[Kung Lao]

I doubt Enma woulkd be able to entrap KN2. He was easily owned by Oro's snakes. Besides Sarutobi won't be able to perform sealing so easy. Sealing jutsus are short range, he would have to go into cage (hipothetically because I really doubt KN2 would be trapped by that cage) and it's a suicide.

As I managed to point that out in my fight against The Truth's team, Enma was directly poked at those snakes by Sarutobi. He then failed to escape them. This isn't the same situation, as Enma may try to entrap Naruto by himself, and Naruto doesn't have any binding jutsus as far as I know. Also if his transformed Pole form is diamond sturdy, and his cage consists of the same Pole's, then I'd doubt that Naruto could easily escape from it.

Also, has anyone considered that the transforming Naruto isn't actually a team fighter? I mean, he can attack those on his side also, as he loses control of himself while gaining those tails.

[Spell]

As I managed to point that out in my fight against The Truth's team, Enma was directly poked at those snakes by Sarutobi. He then failed to escape them.
Of coure he was poked, but sill - was owned.
This isn't the same situation, as Enma may try to entrap Naruto by himself, and Naruto doesn't have any binding jutsus as far as I know. Also if his transformed Pole form is diamond sturdy, and his cage consists of the same Pole's, then I'd doubt that Naruto could easily escape from it.
The first problem for enma is to trap Naruto, I doubt he would be able.
The second problem are welds. Yes, welds.

Enma as a stick is probably extremally resistant, enyone would have problems with breaking this stick. However the cage is created from sticks secured like sticks in a bonefire there are no welds. In that case the cage is resistant for outside pressure but weak for internal deconstruction.

[Kai]

Alright, I'll stick with Raikage. I just see Sarutobi in this fight as an absolute machine, he would plow through New York City ike a playground and Shiki Fuujin 3-4 members on Risu's team as an result of dire emergency.

Let Raikage's team handle the rest, winner Raikage.

[Spell]

I don't understand you Sarutobitards :notrust xD
seems that post timeskip Sasuke would manage with this old man...

Shiki Fuujin 3-4 members on Risu's team as an result of dire emergency.
I can't imagine how he would be able to use Shiki Fuujin on Gaara and KN2, he won't be evan able to come close to them. Hand to hand in close combat he has no chances with those 2.

[Gooba]

I don't understand you Sarutobitards xD
seems that post timeskip Sasuke would manage with this old man...Yea, you lost me right there. Perfect health Oro plus 2 Invincible Hokages barely beat him, and you are saying someone about to fight (probably evenly, or at least close) a very, very weak Oro is better than him?

[sel]

Raikage takes it - Saru, kimi and shika make a deadly combination to teh extent that extent that sasuke might not even be needed. Gaara seemed to be the only person to be able to stop kimi's immense attacks and once Kage mane is done Risu is done for. NYC has a lot of tall buildings aswell so lots of shadows

[Spell]

Yea, you lost me right there. Perfect health Oro plus 2 Invincible Hokages barely beat him, and you are saying someone about to fight (probably evenly, or at least close) a very, very weak Oro is better than him?
As I stated it before in Martryn vs CMX thread, you can't say this fight was 3 on 1.

I will quote myself:
Yeah but if you count summons, it was 3 vs 2 fight. Enma is a factor same as both Hokages. Furthermore for most of the fight Orochimaru was standing and looking, he was taking a pleasure. If he fought that time, Sarutobi would be probably dead before performing Shiki Fuujin.

And during fight with Naruto, Oro wasn't very very weak, he was just a little weaker than usual.

once Kage mane is done Risu is done for. NYC has a lot of tall buildings aswell so lots of shadows
Please read at least my statement. You don't understand NYC is my advantage, Shikamaru post-timeskip is in my team.

[Gooba]

And during fight with Naruto, Oro wasn't very very weak, he was just a little weaker than usual.I wasn't talking about that, I was talking about his fight with Sasuke which is happening now. I bet it is going to be close, and Oro is in the weakest state we have seen him.

Also, you are right, it was 2v3, not 1v3, but that is still the most impressive feat we have witnessed yet.

[Spell]

I wasn't talking about that, I was talking about his fight with Sasuke which is happening now. I bet it is going to be close, and Oro is in the weakest state we have seen him.
Ah :oh , yes but I think we shouldn't talk about it yet :/ (spoilers?)

Also, you are right, it was 2v3, not 1v3, but that is still the most impressive feat we have witnessed yet.
Well it depends, for one it's the most impressive for other it's not. To be honest I'm more impressed with Sasori and Kakuzu, I would put old Sarutobi in a lower Tier, maybe with Tsunade, Gaara, Deidara (comparison to what we've seen, do not assume what Saru would be able to do, only stated facts). But i just don't know now :(.

Also when I was creating tier list for the tournament I forgot to mention I listd Saru in Low Kage tier because I wanted to forbid Shiki Fujin. List is messed in some other places also, but it isn't only my fault :P

[durtycheese]

ill have to go with risu, sarutobi is old and kimmi is sick, gaara, naruto and shika would dominate.

[Kung Lao]

Please read at least my statement. You don't understand NYC is my advantage, Shikamaru post-timeskip is in my team.

NYC is an advantage for Shikamaru, I do have one also, though he isn't as good as the post timeskip one, he is also able to produce a vast amount of shadows and think with that smart brain of his.

[Spell]

NYC is an advantage for Shikamaru, I do have one also, though he isn't as good as the post timeskip one, he is also able to produce a vast amount of shadows and think with that smart brain of his.
Of course, but mine is at least 2 times better :D

[Kung Lao]

Of course, but mine is at least 2 times better :D

:) More agile overall, and a boost to his kage mane from the chakra blades. He probably can keep up the shadow for a longer time, and make it longer, but due to the fact that there are a lot of shadows around him, the latter advantage will be neutralised more or less.

[Spell]

but due to the fact that there are a lot of shadows around him, the latter advantage will be neutralised more or less.
Well not exactly. Post shikamaru's binding is faster and stronger. For example pre shika wouldn't be able to bind KN2, Naruto is too powerfull and fast, gated Lee- too fast and also powerfull, Gaara - pointless due to his sand which is still able to move.

[Kai]

I can't imagine how he would be able to use Shiki Fuujin on Gaara and KN2, he won't be evan able to come close to them. Hand to hand in close combat he has no chances with those 2.

Old man caught 2 hokages in complete darkness. He also managed to capture Orochimaru and hold his ass down while he pulled all their souls out and Oro's arms with a kusanagi through his chest.

Need I remind you that Naruto doesn't start out KN2, its his maximum. Sarutobi does a couple kagebunshins, grab, Shiki, game over.

[Spell]

Old man caught 2 hokages in complete darkness. He also managed to capture Orochimaru and hold his ass down while he pulled all their souls out and Oro's arms with a kusanagi through his chest.
Hokages didn't have tons of sand or chakra protecting them from any hit. Furthermore they were controled by Orochimaru, so that's not like they were at their 100% even.

Need I remind you that Naruto doesn't start out KN2, its his maximum. Sarutobi does a couple kagebunshins, grab, Shiki, game over.
Sarutobi would be a moron if he used Shiki Fujin at the beggining of the fight :laugh , besides time need to create kage bunshins would be enough long for Naruto to go KN2.

[Feral]

Saru vs 2 Hokages wasn't really 2 on 1.

It was 1 on 1 at separate times.. at no point did I see them double team him. They fought him one on one for a little, then switched off.. there was no double teaming. Sorry if I already posted this, but both Hokages at once vs Saru, and Saru would have lost.. he could only handle 1 at a time.

[Gooba]

It was 1 on 1 at separate times.. at no point did I see them double team him. They fought him one on one for a little, then switched off.. there was no double teaming. Sorry if I already posted this, but both Hokages at once vs Saru, and Saru would have lost.. he could only handle 1 at a time.That is still 2v1, and their attacks just didn't lend themselves to happen at the same time. Shooting big Suitons and growing lots of trees kinda cancels out, since the trees could protect him. Plus, trading off is still 2v1, since stamina does matter. Not that it came into play during this fight, outside of the incorrect assumption of an outside observer.

[Orga777]

That is still 2v1, and their attacks just didn't lend themselves to happen at the same time. Shooting big Suitons and growing lots of trees kinda cancels out, since the trees could protect him. Plus, trading off is still 2v1, since stamina does matter. Not that it came into play during this fight, outside of the incorrect assumption of an outside observer.

They were also practically mindless zombies. If they were the REAL Hokage's, I would guarantee that Sarutobi would have died within the first few minutes of that fight. So we really can't use that to Saru's full advantage. That fight Oro did nothing at all after he summoned them, and the two of them were pretty much drones.

[Kung Lao]

By the way.. Was it ever mentioned that Naruto with two tails has hardly penetratable amount of chakra protecting him?

They were also practically mindless zombies. If they were the REAL Hokage's, I would guarantee that Sarutobi would have died within the first few minutes of that fight. So we really can't use that to Saru's full advantage. That fight Oro did nothing at all after he summoned them, and the two of them were pretty much drones.

What's with the mindless Zombies talk? How do you know that they weren't like that originally? (Not the mindless part, but the fighting style) You haven't seen them fight apart from that one time, so you can't say that "Sarutobi would have died within the first few minutes".

[Kai]

Hokages didn't have tons of sand or chakra protecting them from any hit. Furthermore they were controled by Orochimaru, so that's not like they were at their 100% even.
Complete Darkness > Sand protection. Temari and Kankurou have carried Gaara through the forest without any sand protection interfering. If Sarutobi is just touching Gaara's shoulders, the sand will not interfere. KageBunshin, Shiki, game over for 3 souls on your team.


Sarutobi would be a moron if he used Shiki Fujin at the beggining of the fight :laugh , besides time need to create kage bunshins would be enough long for Naruto to go KN2.

Poor argument on your side. Naruto only turns kyuubi when his emotions hit a peak, and transforming to KN2 isn't exactly a swift process.

We debate how one team can win, not if Sandaime is a moron for using Shiki Fuujin at the start of the battle. He can, and it will be successful.

[Orga777]

What's with the mindless Zombies talk? How do you know that they weren't like that originally? (Not the mindless part, but the fighting style) You haven't seen them fight apart from that one time, so you can't say that "Sarutobi would have died within the first few minutes".

They were obviously not using the same fighting styles. Yamato has the abilities of the Shodai, and not once in the fight, except for the forset set up, were these abilties used for an advantage. They were also EASILY caught off guard numerous times by Sarutobi. The two Hokage's that practically trained him would NOT easily get caught in that situation even if Sarutobi was stronger. They were also not exactly what I would call fast either. Nothing in that fight suggested that they are as dangerous as their living selves since they are not using many of their abilities to their advantage, easily getting caught in rather avoidable traps, and they really were not that fast. Because of their mindlessness, they were unable to replicate a strategy at all which did make it somewhat easier on Sarutobi to fight them.

[Turrin]

Risu wins eventhough Raikage has sarutobi
Lee s enough w/o gates to defeat Ino + Shikamaru extremely quickly...both ino and shikka have no way to counter lee's speed. Meanwhile post-sakura can hold of kimmi untill lee's done...rember kimmi tends to just toy with his opponets...then lee will join in and activate 5 gates and defeat kimmi after which lee will be out of the battle and sakura will be hurt but she can still act as medic

Garaa can tie CS2 sasuke...the match will end in a tie more then likely

That leaves Naruto + Shikka + Sakura to heal to fight sarutobi although sarutobi is a beast...naruto two tails can probably hold him off for quite some time giving shikka the prep-time needed to set up a plan. Then sakura after fighting kimmi will join in and use medic ninjutsu to heal naruto so he can help fight sarutobi in base after fighting him in KN2. Shikka will put his plan into action and together they will pull out a victory...even thos sarutobi has shikka he will lose because shikkmaru will prevent him from using it with shadow bind

[Spell]

Complete Darkness > Sand protection.
0_o what?
Darkness doesn't give you any protection, it's only darkness and it makes same disadvantage for performer and opponent. Sand protects from any attack. In that case Sand protection >>>>>>>Darkness when you want to protect yourself from Shiki Fuujin.
Temari and Kankurou have carried Gaara through the forest without any sand protection interfering.And? This fact has nothing to do with the topic.

If Sarutobi is just touching Gaara's shoulders, the sand will not interfere. 0_o

KageBunshin, Shiki, game over for 3 souls on your team.
Game over, but for Sarutobi.



Poor argument on your side. Naruto only turns kyuubi when his emotions hit a peak, and transforming to KN2 isn't exactly a swift process.
After timeskip Naruto is able to transform when he wants, this fight would give (even in the beginning) enough emotions for sure.

We debate how one team can win, not if Sandaime is a moron for using Shiki Fuujin at the start of the battle. He can, and it will be successful.
Sarutobi has no knowledge who are his opponents. He may know only Lee, rest shinobi from my team are post-saru's death. It would be absolutely debilic to perform Shiki Fujin as a first jutsu, it's like:

Sarutobi: Oh a ninja on my way.
*Shiki Fujin*
Sarutobi: Heh, now you know why they called me a God of Shinobi, I'm perfect in my strategy - suicide jutsu in the beginning of fight, that's it.

See xD ?

[Kung Lao]

They were obviously not using the same fighting styles. Yamato has the abilities of the Shodai, and not once in the fight, except for the forset set up, were these abilties used for an advantage. They were also EASILY caught off guard numerous times by Sarutobi. The two Hokage's that practically trained him would NOT easily get caught in that situation even if Sarutobi was stronger. They were also not exactly what I would call fast either. Nothing in that fight suggested that they are as dangerous as their living selves since they are not using many of their abilities to their advantage, easily getting caught in rather avoidable traps, and they really were not that fast. Because of their mindlessness, they were unable to replicate a strategy at all which did make it somewhat easier on Sarutobi to fight them.

Yamato has the Mokuton. That doesn't make him the same person as the Shodai Hokage. The fact that they taught Sarutobi for his rougly what.. 15 years of life doesn't mean that he can't outsmart them, or land a blow on them either. And we also don't have any knowledge about their speed when they were alive, maybe they weren't fast at all.

Risu wins eventhough Raikage has sarutobi


Well, you assumed that Lee started without weights. That Naruto can hold off Sarutobi for the length of 2 fights of other people. Also those were quite possibly the worst matchups for my team. I think that either of the 2 teams can come out with combinations of mini fights that will take the other team out with a high probability. That was the reason I didn't do a writeup on the fight itself in the first place. If I'd put favorable fights for my team, Risu would put favorable fights for his team.

[Kuya]

This match is over 8pm Hawaii Time (3/1/07). Votes after will not be counted.

[Kung Lao]

How does Hawaii compare to CET?

[Kuya]

no clue, all i know is that over here in Honolulu, during daylight savings we're only 2 hours behind San Francisco. Without daylight savings, we're 3 hours behind.

So right now if u can compare to San Francisco time, we're 2 hours behind them.

[Kung Lao]

Checked it, it's GMT -10, so I guess that'd mean it's CET -11. By the way.. Nice place to live in.. It's a big dream of many to even step on the soil of Hawaii :)

[Kuya]

Thanks, it IS a beautiful place. Life is nice and slow. I'm lucky to be goin to school out here. I still miss my San Francisco tho.

[Kuya]

wsup my nigs, sorry i been kinda slackin the past 2 days. i had 2 exams and tonite we're throwin a party in my dorms, so i'll be back 2morrow with the votes and hopefully the final round (it's gonna be a 3-way match)

[Spell]

So, is this match over?

[Kung Lao]

Probably Kuya will end it when he wakes up. It's like 5AM in Hawaii..

[Spell]

Ah ok :)

[Kung Lao]

When this thing was about to end the scores were:

Vote:

Risu: 11
Raikage: 12

Reply:

Risu win:
Kyon
Feral
CrazyMoronX
Orga777
naruhina26
durtycheese
Turrin

Raikage win:
MISTNINJA
narutofangd
Gooba
Space
Blue
Son et Lumiere

Don't know how you count the points though.

[Spell]

Oh see it's 12/12 :P

Kuya said that vote counts as 1 and reply count as 2 (if I remember correct)

[Kung Lao]

In that case you won by 1 point. Congratulations!

[Kyon]

Risu won?

Thank god. At least the person who beat me made it to the finals.

[Kai]

Risu won?

Thank god. At least the person who beat me made it to the finals.

And what do you know? No Sarutobi.

[Spell]

In that case you won by 1 point. Congratulations!
Hm, it seems it's a tie. :P so don't congrat because you may win this :)

Where is Kuya? This fight should be over a day ago :omg

[Kuya]

my bad everyone. my gf's been using my computer so it's been at her place because i got banned from my IP address from downloading. but now i got my internet back. i'm going to count right now.

[Kuya]

When this thing was about to end the scores were:

Vote:

Risu: 11
Raikage: 12

Reply:

Risu win:
Kyon
Feral
CrazyMoronX
Orga777
naruhina26
durtycheese
Turrin

Raikage win:
MISTNINJA
narutofangd
Gooba
Space
Blue
Son et Lumiere

Don't know how you count the points though.

the votes now say 14/14, but i'm gonna trust you with the vote count.

[Kuya]

Poll Vote

Risu -11
Raikage 12

Thread votes

Risu - Kyon, Feral, Risu, CMX, Orga, Durttycheese, Turrin = 14
Raikage - MistNinja, Gooba, Space, Blue, Raikage, Son of L = 12

i'm not counting NaruHina's vote. There was no explanation involved, only "Risu wins this one." Narutofangd vote isn't counted either. It's only stated that Sarutobi will make up for Ino. Not a victory.

Risu = 25
Raiakge = 24

VERY CLOSE MATCH. congrats Risu.

[Spell]

Thanks Raikage for the match, it was a really close fight :)