Portgas D. Ace vs. The Human Torch

[Dark Evangel]

fire vs. fire

[Iris]

Hard to say, Johnny is faster than Ace though, he moves at the speed of sound.

Unless Ace can produce flames over 1 million° I don't see him winning...

I'll go with Johnny for now, unless someone proves otherwise.

[MdB]

Is it even possible to beat fire with fire.

[Iris]

Is it even possible to beat fire with fire.

Yes, that's only if Ace could make attacks of temperature above 1million degree.

[blacklusterseph004]

This is a draw isn't it? Unless Ace just tries to punch Johnny to death, which (from the little I know about fantastic 4) might actually work

[Orion]

Hmm i think its a tie......neither of them could really hurt each other.

[Birkin]

What vlaaad just said

[blacklusterseph004]

Torch isn't immune to taking physical shots like Ace is though, so seeing as Ace can't be burnt either, couldn't he presumably hit Johnny until he dies or something?

[Violent Man]

Ace wins. You can't burn actual fire. So Ace will just beat him to death.

[Roll]

Too evenly matched I'd have to go with a tie. :nod

[Iris]

Torch isn't immune to taking physical shots like Ace is though, so seeing as Ace can't be burnt either, couldn't he presumably hit Johnny until he dies or something?

Then I guess none win this since Johnny can fly at the speed of sound...

[Goodfellow]

Hmm, could The Torch put out the flames of Ace maybe? By burning all the oxygen around him, or something fancy like that?

[Orion]

Hmm, could The Torch put out the flames of Ace maybe? By burning all the oxygen around him, or something fancy like that?

Considering ace is fire incarnate....probably not,logia's are the element themselves,they dont rely on outside things to be the element.

[Endless Mike]

Yet they have weaknesses that are based on the real science of their element (sand clumps when it meets water, rubber doesn't conduct electricity....)

[Gunshin]

Then I guess none win this since Johnny can fly at the speed of sound...

But assuming this is a fight, which it is, "retreating" is the same as losing. I'd also like to note that Ace is really really fast in fighting.

[Limit_Tester]

Ace can punch him to death I guess.....

[shadowrocks17]

OMG Johnny losing to Ace? LOL:laugh

You OPtards must've not read any fantastic four comics, Jezze, Johnny is hotter than the surface of the sun, he'll flame on at a 1,000,000 celsius with ease and out flame Ace.


Read this:The Torch's primary power is to envelop himself in, and manipulate fire.He can also manipulate smoke such as to turn into his fiery form. The Human Torch can direct this flame as a blast of superheated plasma, or manipulate it for various shapes, temperatures, or effects. He can absorb flame into his body, or extinguish ambient flame at will. The Torch has the ability to fly in excess of the speed of sound, and has sufficient ambient heat to vaporize projectiles that approach him. The Torch has been observed to vaporize rocks, bottles, bullets, and even steel girders in fractions of a second; yet this ambient heat does not extend beyond his body, or ignite objects in proximity to him. The uppermost level of The Human Torch's power is his "Nova Flame," which is usually released omni-directionally and reaches temperatures of 1,000,000 degrees Celsius. Any level lower than this cannot burn him. This effect can occur spontaneously when he absorbs an excessive amount of heat into his body although he can momentarily suppress the release when necessary with considerable effort. The Human Torch can also direct beams of "Nova Heat" as an offensive weapon for very brief periods of time before his heat energy gives out.

The Torch was once limited by the quantity of oxygen in his environment, and has been extinguished by sufficient quantities of water, flame retardant foam, and vacuum environments. He can re-ignite instantly once oxygen is returned, with no ill effects.

His protection from fire doesn't seem to apply to hellfire, although it is unknown whether this is because the hellfire is mystical in nature, or if it's simply that much hotter than his own form can protect.


Until Ace can fly in space and go up to people like Silver Surfer and Doom, than it's a curbstomp in Johnny's favor.

[Kunoichi no Kiri]

Ace still needs to breathe.

[Orion]

Ace still needs to breathe.

Enel being in space seems to suggest logia's dont need to breathe

[shadowrocks17]

Enel being in space seems to suggest logia's dont need to breatheFuck That.:mad Tell how Ace could survie in Space, and not die.

[Kunoichi no Kiri]

Enel being in space seems to suggest logia's dont need to breathe
Enel never made it to space.

Unless you've got a theory on how he made it to the moon with a propeller-driven craft?

[Orion]

Enel never made it to space.

Unless you've got a theory on how he made it to the moon with a propeller-driven craft?

havnt looked at the latest chapter covers have you?hes already there.

[Locard]

Johnny absorbs Ace

[''White Chase'' Smoker]

i dont see torch doin anything to ace.even if he can outheat ace, it wouldnt make much a difference. in the end, ace could just pyhsically beat him

[Gunshin]

In most cases Ace wins this. He can speed blitz Torch with physical attacks. The only case for Johnny winning would be to "absorb" Ace... theres two problems with that:

1. Would Ace die? Probably not. He'd probably just materialize inside of Torch and kill him Kitty Pride style.

2. Can Torch actually absorb him? Ace got his abilities by the magical devil fruits. Seeing how Torch cannot control Hellfire due to its mystical nature, why would he be able to control Ace?

[shadowrocks17]

In most cases Ace wins this. He can speed blitz Torch with physical attacks. The only case for Johnny winning would be to "absorb" Ace... theres two problems with that:

1. Would Ace die? Probably not. He'd probably just materialize inside of Torch and kill him Kitty Pride style.

2. Can Torch actually absorb him? Ace got his abilities by the magical devil fruits. Seeing how Torch cannot control Hellfire due to its mystical nature, why would he be able to control Ace?Thats all baised, Ace is not that fast at all.

1.Prove it, and show scans.

3.Just because Ace ate a devil fruit doesn't mean he's hellfire incarnate. There's not proof.

Until Ace can fly into sppace and survie, Johnny wins by fly out in space.

[shadowrocks17]

i dont see torch doin anything to ace.even if he can outheat ace, it wouldnt make much a difference. in the end, ace could just pyhsically beat himNova Flare>>>>>>>>Heat fist. And if that doesn't work, he just carry ace in to the sun our the vaccum of space until he frezzes to death and dies.

[Timur Lane]

[QUOTE=shadowrocks17;6946051]
3.Just because Ace ate a devil fruit doesn't mean he's hellfire incarnate. There's not proof.
[QUOTE]

What he meant was that devil fruits is magical objects, Johhny,s power comes from cosmic beams and not a magical source (which is the reason he couldent contain or manipulate hellfire)

It is as simple as that.

[Orion]

Thats all baised, Ace is not that fast at all.

1.Prove it, and show scans.

3.Just because Ace ate a devil fruit doesn't mean he's hellfire incarnate. There's not proof.

Until Ace can fly into sppace and survie, Johnny wins by fly out in space.

How does running away into space make johnny win?

[shadowrocks17]

How does running away into space make johnny win?He carries Ace with him and drops him in to the vaccume of space.

[MdB]

So you're saying he can litterly grab fire?

[Orion]

He carries Ace with him and drops him in to the vaccume of space.

Lets ignore the fact that any attempts to grab ace would go right through him,logia's have been shown to survive in space so its still not a win.

[Shinkirou]

Tie, since I dont see either of them really being able to harm the other.

[Hype]

Lets ignore the fact that any attempts to grab ace would go right through him,logia's have been shown to survive in space so its still not a win.

Even as harcore OP fan I wont acept that

Even if Ace fire is persay magic I cant see him surviving in space

Fire needs oxegen , space is a vacuum yada yada yada

[Shinkirou]

Shouldn't the torch need oxygen then?

[Timur Lane]

Shouldn't the torch need oxygen then?

The real weird thing is that he don,t.
He can still fly around in space without needing oxygen, it isent only OP who ignores physics here.

[Orion]

Even as harcore OP fan I wont acept that

Even if Ace fire is persay magic I cant see him surviving in space

Fire needs oxegen , space is a vacuum yada yada yada

Logias dont follow much logic,the only person in op who has gone in space is a logia and he doesnt seem bothered by it,so i dont see why we cant assume ace could be in space as well.

[MdB]

Even as harcore OP fan I wont acept that

Even if Ace fire is persay magic I cant see him surviving in space

Fire needs oxegen , space is a vacuum yada yada yada

Fire needs oxygen, but ace would still survive in space or did you forget that enel wasn't in his elemental state, when he was traveling to the moon.

Enel proved that logia's dont need to breath

[Limit_Tester]

Enel never made it to space.

Unless you've got a theory on how he made it to the moon with a propeller-driven craft?

Maxim also has a Jet Dial backup propulsion system.

[~Shin~]

Fire needs oxygen, but ace would still survive in space or did you forget that enel wasn't in his elemental state, when he was traveling to the moon.

Enel proved that logia's dont need to breath

No, enel was always in his logia form. You can't just choose not to be in logia form, it's a permanent form

[MdB]

No, enel was always in his logia form. You can't just choose not to be in logia form, it's a permanent form

Actually there not human nor element in there default state. They can still eat and drink.

[~Shin~]

^I don't really how that works in OP, but enel was in his logia form even when he was sleeping

[MdB]

^I don't really how that works in OP, but enel was in his logia form even when he was sleeping

Pipboy had a good theory about OP logia's but i'm to lazy to find it.

[~Shin~]

^I'll ask pipboy about it

[Gunshin]

Thats all baised, Ace is not that fast at all.

1.Prove it, and show scans.

3.Just because Ace ate a devil fruit doesn't mean he's hellfire incarnate. There's not proof.

Until Ace can fly into sppace and survie, Johnny wins by fly out in space.
1. I'm not saying that he does that. I'm saying that absorbing Ace's fire wouldn't do anything, because he can revert to his solid state.

3. Reading and comprehension. I'm not saying Ace is Hellfire. I'm saying, like Hellfire, Ace's fire is from a mystical source. It comes from the magical Devil Fruits.

And as for your "fly him into space" gig. How is Torch bringing him into space? Ace is way faster than Torch under normal circumstances. I guess you're suggesting that Torch swoop down in flight speed and grab him. Sadly, if he "grabs" Ace, Ace can turn into fire and slip through.. assuming that he didn't just let Johny phase through him in the first place. Furthermore, Ace would KO Johnny from the distance within the clinch.

[Limit_Tester]

http://forums.narutofan.com/showthread.php?p=6834327#post6834327

[Iris]

He carries Ace with him and drops him in to the vaccume of space.

I don't see Johnny doing that, even if he somehow menages to grab Ace.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWdy_-mYGV0

[Enclave]

I don't see Johnny doing that, even if he somehow menages to grab Ace.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWdy_-mYGV0

While I cannot recall for certain if in the comics Johnny gets extinguished in a vacuume I can say that you most certainly do not want to use a scene from a movie in such a discussion as this.

[Kazuma the Shell Bullet]

Draw, I guess

[potential]

Wut Up Biatchs im Back!!!!!!!!!!! Johnny wins by absorbing Ace.